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Post by ox1yellow on Feb 26, 2014 10:27:13 GMT
I've been trying to get my head around the ongoing (and lengthy) discussions about all this. I will never fully understand why there is so much animosity directed at people that are trying to represent the fans and make the match day experience better, but I guess everyone has their own issues and agenda.
So for me, OxVox (of which I am a member) should have a democratically elected committee and should provide the wider world (the club, the football league, the media etc.) with a consolidated fans voice on major issues impacting the club and football in general. They are there to represent the fans in debates and challenge any actions that do not appear to be in the best interests of the fans or the club. They should raise money to cover their running costs and charity initiatives and be fully accountable for their running/finances etc as people are paying money to join (as you would with a sports club where you pay a membership fee etc.). They should be fully independent of the football club to avoid any conflict of interests and are kind of political in a way.
IMO, The Yellow Army is very different. It is there to improve the match day experience in cooperation with the club and provide a central point for feeding ideas and resources into match day and supporter initiatives. It should be firmly non-political (leaving that to OxVox) and is a bit more of a charity type set up - people volunteering to be involved and helping out where they can. I don't see a need for a democratically elected committee and the same level of accountability as you get with OxVox as it is not gathering membership fees and is more about providing time and resource rather than a voice as such. Yes, some people may not agree with their actions, but you influence this by actually volunteering rather than paying a membership fee and shouting loudly like you do with OxVox.
The issue is where the YA stray into OxVox territory and visa-versa and this is where a firm 'scope of remit' needs to be drawn up. Ideally the people running the two groups are independent of each of other, however I appreciate this may not be possible.
Does this make sense to others in the way it does to me?
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Post by sarge on Feb 26, 2014 10:41:36 GMT
12th feb 2014 ( very recently) BBC Sport reported this www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26141427Football Supporters Federation have had a long (err) standing campaign re Safe Standing which is gaining momentum with every passing week (NOTE...even that shower who play at the skip the other end of A420 , along with the Plastics, have signed up to it!!!!!....OUFC HAD a golden chance to be right at the forefront of this national campaign being run BY supporters FOR supporters .....and a couple of seasons ago the open day actually had the safe standing roadshow visit, theres a pic or two of James Constable (I think) standing on the sample of safe standing that was AT the stadium that day!, yet the current OUFC Administration seem reluctant, to say the least, to 'get involved' ( despite all the work & subsequent agreement in principle with the KT OUFC administration to support safe standing at OUFC)....WHY NOT? www.fsf.org.uk/campaigns/safe-standing/
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Post by sihath on Feb 26, 2014 10:47:42 GMT
12th feb 2014 ( very recently) BBC Sport reported this www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26141427Football Supporters Federation have had a long (err) standing campaign re Safe Standing which is gaining momentum with every passing week (NOTE...even that shower who play at the skip the other end of A420 , along with the Plastics, have signed up to it!!!!!....OUFC HAD a golden chance to be right at the forefront of this national campaign being run BY supporters FOR supporters .....and a couple of seasons ago the open day actually had the safe standing roadshow visit, theres a pic or two of James Constable (I think) standing on the sample of safe standing that was AT the stadium that day!, yet the current OUFC Administration seem reluctant, to say the least, to 'get involved' ( despite all the work & subsequent agreement in principle with the KT OUFC administration to support safe standing at OUFC)....WHY NOT? www.fsf.org.uk/campaigns/safe-standing/ I would suggest this is something for OxVox and not the YA. Bring it up at the next OxVox meeting?
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Post by scotters on Feb 26, 2014 10:59:32 GMT
Can't help feeling that the whole safe standing campaign from fans or fans' groups is just pissing in the wind. Has there ever been any real indication that the people who would make the decision have any inclination to change?
I'll sign up to a petition or whatever but in terms of spending resources, I think campaigners might be better off finding better uses for their time.
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Post by SteMerritt on Feb 26, 2014 11:05:32 GMT
Can't help feeling that the whole safe standing campaign from fans or fans' groups is just pissing in the wind. Has there ever been any real indication that the people who would make the decision have any inclination to change? I'll sign up to a petition or whatever but in terms of spending resources, I think campaigners might be better off finding better uses for their time. It will never change unless people push for it. The more noise that is made, the more likely a change will be. And I still can't work out why you are allowed to stand at a gig, but not at football - a gig crowd is a much more fluid and crushing beast than a football crowd. Or how come you can stand at Rugby (not that I'd ever consider watching a game of that)?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2014 11:09:03 GMT
I've been trying to get my head around the ongoing (and lengthy) discussions about all this. I will never fully understand why there is so much animosity directed at people that are trying to represent the fans and make the match day experience better, but I guess everyone has their own issues and agenda. So for me, OxVox (of which I am a member) should have a democratically elected committee and should provide the wider world (the club, the football league, the media etc.) with a consolidated fans voice on major issues impacting the club and football in general. They are there to represent the fans in debates and challenge any actions that do not appear to be in the best interests of the fans or the club. They should raise money to cover their running costs and charity initiatives and be fully accountable for their running/finances etc as people are paying money to join (as you would with a sports club where you pay a membership fee etc.). They should be fully independent of the football club to avoid any conflict of interests and are kind of political in a way. IMO, The Yellow Army is very different. It is there to improve the match day experience in cooperation with the club and provide a central point for feeding ideas and resources into match day and supporter initiatives. It should be firmly non-political (leaving that to OxVox) and is a bit more of a charity type set up - people volunteering to be involved and helping out where they can. I don't see a need for a democratically elected committee and the same level of accountability as you get with OxVox as it is not gathering membership fees and is more about providing time and resource rather than a voice as such. Yes, some people may not agree with their actions, but you influence this by actually volunteering rather than paying a membership fee and shouting loudly like you do with OxVox. The issue is where the YA stray into OxVox territory and visa-versa and this is where a firm 'scope of remit' needs to be drawn up. Ideally the people running the two groups are independent of each of other, however I appreciate this may not be possible. Does this make sense to others in the way it does to me? Excellent distinction between the two fans' groups. Can't see how anyone could be "elected" to the YA, which doesn't have a board or a constitution and is simply a group of supporters raising funds for OUFC. YA does need to operate with clear approval from OUFC to sell X at Y prices. Honesty will have to be taken for granted, although stock out/funds in can obviously be monitored, recorded through normal accountancy practice and open for inspection. As for the "improving the match day experience" side of the YA, can anyone honestly criticise their intentions? I'd be happy to support the YA as a fan of OUFC, although this nebulous idea that the YA is "all of us" needs to be dropped. Some people intrinsically do not want to belong to any club, formal or informal, and since the YA has no elected voice no-one should be trying to speak for "us". OxVox is different, as made clear above. Working closely with ownership/management is not the same as being in their pocket. I think OxVox have the right balance.
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Post by sarge on Feb 26, 2014 11:26:36 GMT
I've been trying to get my head around the ongoing (and lengthy) discussions about all this. I will never fully understand why there is so much animosity directed at people that are trying to represent the fans and make the match day experience better, but I guess everyone has their own issues and agenda. So for me, OxVox (of which I am a member) should have a democratically elected committee and should provide the wider world (the club, the football league, the media etc.) with a consolidated fans voice on major issues impacting the club and football in general. They are there to represent the fans in debates and challenge any actions that do not appear to be in the best interests of the fans or the club. They should raise money to cover their running costs and charity initiatives and be fully accountable for their running/finances etc as people are paying money to join (as you would with a sports club where you pay a membership fee etc.). They should be fully independent of the football club to avoid any conflict of interests and are kind of political in a way. IMO, The Yellow Army is very different. It is there to improve the match day experience in cooperation with the club and provide a central point for feeding ideas and resources into match day and supporter initiatives. It should be firmly non-political (leaving that to OxVox) and is a bit more of a charity type set up - people volunteering to be involved and helping out where they can. I don't see a need for a democratically elected committee and the same level of accountability as you get with OxVox as it is not gathering membership fees and is more about providing time and resource rather than a voice as such. Yes, some people may not agree with their actions, but you influence this by actually volunteering rather than paying a membership fee and shouting loudly like you do with OxVox. The issue is where the YA stray into OxVox territory and visa-versa and this is where a firm 'scope of remit' needs to be drawn up. Ideally the people running the two groups are independent of each of other, however I appreciate this may not be possible. Does this make sense to others in the way it does to me? IN the main it makes sense...BUT....the Ultras go about their business and are self funded for the multitude of flag/banner displays etc ( although less than they seemed to before of late)....they have NO agenda other than to fanatically promote OUFC on matchdays, and more power to them too I say....as they dont claim to represent anyone other than themselves.....unlike Yellow Army, who stated intent to improve the matchday experience & atmosphere I support....though in a previous post on this thread, Ive voiced MY perspective on why I feel the matchday experience (and atmosphere) this season is at an all time low.....( for the record Ive been supporting Oxford United since just after the name change from Headington United...first game Home to Bath Cityin the southern league, we lost 3-1!)......IF Yellow Army were autonomous (as the Ultras are) no problem wit that.....however, from the outside looking in....the demise/forcing out of 12th Man with Yellow Army immediately taking up the fundraising role doesnt seem quite right or straightforward......Im still awaiting an answer to several questions posed including.... where & how does Charlie Methven, ( who IS involved on the OUFC club administration) fit in? ....... is he a stooge for the board to maintain control over YA ensuring they toe the party line ( like giving their unconditional support to a bar that IS clearly NOT in reality 'good' for OUFC supporters for many reasons.... yes including the MYSTERY percentage split!!!)...& maybe he reports back to the board on anything that YA may want to try & achieve? .....I may be wrong & way off the mark on this but,as Metheven has arrived 'on the scene' in the past few seasons, coinciding with the current Board taking up the reigns,(hmmmmm).... with his clear involvement on the OUFC Administration ( youth set up Im told), Im suspicious, cynic that I am, that its a bit too coincidental!!!.......... as an aside, whats Charlie Methven's background, is he a season ticket holder, how long has he been an Oxford United supporter, does he travel to awaydays on minibuses arranged by mates? the list of questions unanswered on that score is endless isnt it?...... whereas the 'credentials' of Mark Sennett & Joe Nicholls as OUFC supporters are well known ( as were those of Trevor Lambert) re YA/ Oxvox....I agree there is the potential for a crossover of interests & that there maybe should be a representative of Oxvox involved to a degree, however Im not so sure that the Oxvox rep' to YA should be the Oxvox chairman.... though that is more of a point of debate for the Oxvox membership to decide I think ( Im a member of Oxvox) So why is it the minute 12th man ( who were fundraising for the club) are forced out.....Yellow Army merchandise is about to appear? hmmmm, another 'coincidence' that doesnt seem quite right to me As Ive said in previous posts on this thread Ive huge respect for anyone who has the time & desire to put in to improving the lot of OUFC supporters....however...once anyone goes beyond, (the way the Ultras (for example) go about things), being autonomous .... & if there is a claim to represent ALL (OUFC) fans/supporters IMO there should be accountability, because if some claims to represent my interests on my behalf, I like to have the chance, should things be progressing in a way Im not happy with, to be able to voice an opinion.
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Post by sarge on Feb 26, 2014 11:37:07 GMT
Can't help feeling that the whole safe standing campaign from fans or fans' groups is just pissing in the wind. Has there ever been any real indication that the people who would make the decision have any inclination to change? I'll sign up to a petition or whatever but in terms of spending resources, I think campaigners might be better off finding better uses for their time. have a read of these links scotters...you may then realise the wind you talk about pissing into may have changed its direction... www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26141427www.fsf.org.uk/campaigns/safe-standing/
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Post by essexyellows on Feb 26, 2014 11:40:25 GMT
OK. So what realistic, tangible things do fans want the YA to do. Not things that OxVox already do, or are the 'appropriate' organisation to deal with, but things that fans think will improve the matchday atmosphere, that can be implemented quickly. 1. Tell us what the split is on the bar. Seems they are "running things" in there now? Apart from that..... everything else I can think of comes under Oxvox & the Clubs remit. Re-open the Priory. Allow unreserved seating. Push for safe standing. Think before they price Cup tickets. Re-introduce the "First Cup game free" on the ST. That`ll do for me as a start.....
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Post by Mark Sennett on Feb 26, 2014 11:41:03 GMT
On safe standing we mentioned this to Ian Lenagan at our recent meeting. He was in favour of us exploring fans views on it. We carried out a survey and it was overwhelmingly in favour of safe standing although members made clear they didn't feel it was a pressing issue as we don't own the stadium and nothing will change unless we do or a 4th stand is built. These results have been shared with the club. So to be clear Club is not against safe standing they just haven't played a leading role as they don't own the ground. I will now follow this up with Ian as to his views moving forwards.
Again an example of us involving members and raising their views. Sarge knows of another matter he's raised where we have done this as this is what OxVox is here to do represent members' views. Please do contact us if there's something you'd like us to raise
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Post by sihath on Feb 26, 2014 11:48:37 GMT
I've been trying to get my head around the ongoing (and lengthy) discussions about all this. I will never fully understand why there is so much animosity directed at people that are trying to represent the fans and make the match day experience better, but I guess everyone has their own issues and agenda. So for me, OxVox (of which I am a member) should have a democratically elected committee and should provide the wider world (the club, the football league, the media etc.) with a consolidated fans voice on major issues impacting the club and football in general. They are there to represent the fans in debates and challenge any actions that do not appear to be in the best interests of the fans or the club. They should raise money to cover their running costs and charity initiatives and be fully accountable for their running/finances etc as people are paying money to join (as you would with a sports club where you pay a membership fee etc.). They should be fully independent of the football club to avoid any conflict of interests and are kind of political in a way. IMO, The Yellow Army is very different. It is there to improve the match day experience in cooperation with the club and provide a central point for feeding ideas and resources into match day and supporter initiatives. It should be firmly non-political (leaving that to OxVox) and is a bit more of a charity type set up - people volunteering to be involved and helping out where they can. I don't see a need for a democratically elected committee and the same level of accountability as you get with OxVox as it is not gathering membership fees and is more about providing time and resource rather than a voice as such. Yes, some people may not agree with their actions, but you influence this by actually volunteering rather than paying a membership fee and shouting loudly like you do with OxVox. The issue is where the YA stray into OxVox territory and visa-versa and this is where a firm 'scope of remit' needs to be drawn up. Ideally the people running the two groups are independent of each of other, however I appreciate this may not be possible. Does this make sense to others in the way it does to me? IN the main it makes sense...BUT....the Ultras go about their business and are self funded for the multitude of flag/banner displays etc ( although less than they seemed to before of late)....they have NO agenda other than to fanatically promote OUFC on matchdays, and more power to them too I say....as they dont claim to represent anyone other than themselves.....unlike Yellow Army, who stated intent to improve the matchday experience & atmosphere I support....though in a previous post on this thread, Ive voiced MY perspective on why I feel the matchday experience (and atmosphere) this season is at an all time low.....( for the record Ive been supporting Oxford United since just after the name change from Headington United...first game Home to Bath Cityin the southern league, we lost 3-1!)......IF Yellow Army were autonomous (as the Ultras are) no problem wit that.....however, from the outside looking in....the demise/forcing out of 12th Man with Yellow Army immediately taking up the fundraising role doesnt seem quite right or straightforward......Im still awaiting an answer to several questions posed including.... where & how does Charlie Methven, ( who IS involved on the OUFC club administration) fit in? ....... is he a stooge for the board to maintain control over YA ensuring they toe the party line ( like giving their unconditional support to a bar that IS clearly NOT in reality 'good' for OUFC supporters for many reasons.... yes including the MYSTERY percentage split!!!)...& maybe he reports back to the board on anything that YA may want to try & achieve? .....I may be wrong & way off the mark on this but,as Metheven has arrived 'on the scene' in the past few seasons, coinciding with the current Board taking up the reigns,(hmmmmm).... with his clear involvement on the OUFC Administration ( youth set up Im told), Im suspicious, cynic that I am, that its a bit too coincidental!!!.......... as an aside, whats Charlie Methven's background, is he a season ticket holder, how long has he been an Oxford United supporter, does he travel to awaydays on minibuses arranged by mates? the list of questions unanswered on that score is endless isnt it?...... whereas the 'credentials' of Mark Sennett & Joe Nicholls as OUFC supporters are well known ( as were those of Trevor Lambert) re YA/ Oxvox....I agree there is the potential for a crossover of interests & that there maybe should be a representative of Oxvox involved to a degree, however Im not so sure that the Oxvox rep' to YA should be the Oxvox chairman.... though that is more of a point of debate for the Oxvox membership to decide I think ( Im a member of Oxvox) So why is it the minute 12th man ( who were fundraising for the club) are forced out.....Yellow Army merchandise is about to appear? hmmmm, another 'coincidence' that doesnt seem quite right to me As Ive said in previous posts on this thread Ive huge respect for anyone who has the time & desire to put in to improving the lot of OUFC supporters....however...once anyone goes beyond, (the way the Ultras (for example) go about things), being autonomous .... & if there is a claim to represent ALL (OUFC) fans/supporters IMO there should be accountability, because if some claims to represent my interests on my behalf, I like to have the chance, should things be progressing in a way Im not happy with, to be able to voice an opinion. Sarge, why not ask Charlie at the next game what his background supporting Oxford is. If you need to know what he looks like, google "Charlie Methven" look at the images, he's always around the 12th Man Bar before matches, and I'm sure he'll reassure you he's a genuine Oxford fan, with his own "credentials" just like the rest of us. The implication that he's a stooge for the board is wide of the mark, and I think reflects badly on you. I remember Junior getting on his high horse when some of us went on Soccer AM as the fans of the week. 6 season ticket holders, and 2 non-ST but regular attenders. But because he didn't recognise or know more than 2 or 3 of us, he didn't think we were "real" Oxford fans. We have fans from all walks of life, all ages, who all enjoy supporting the club in their own ways. No one is being forced to wear a YA uniform or pledge allegiance to the flag. The phrase "we're ALL the Yellow army" is right. I'm sure if you asked Joe nicely he'd be happy to change any merchandise to say "We're the Yellow Army - except Sarge"
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Post by scotters on Feb 26, 2014 11:49:07 GMT
Can't help feeling that the whole safe standing campaign from fans or fans' groups is just pissing in the wind. Has there ever been any real indication that the people who would make the decision have any inclination to change? I'll sign up to a petition or whatever but in terms of spending resources, I think campaigners might be better off finding better uses for their time. have a read of these links scotters...you may then realise the wind you talk about pissing into may have changed its direction... www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26141427www.fsf.org.uk/campaigns/safe-standing/Certainly hope you're right Sarge, but the first news story applies to rugby fans only - with the laws as they are those stands might as well be in Twickenham - and for the FSF, I've yet to see any real evidence that convinces me they're gaining traction outside of football fan circles. There's no interest at the government level in lifting a finger to make changes that would improve life for football fans.
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Post by sarge on Feb 26, 2014 11:56:40 GMT
On safe standing we mentioned this to Ian Lenagan at our recent meeting. He was in favour of us exploring fans views on it. We carried out a survey and it was overwhelmingly in favour of safe standing although members made clear they didn't feel it was a pressing issue as we don't own the stadium and nothing will change unless we do or a 4th stand is built. These results have been shared with the club. So to be clear Club is not against safe standing they just haven't played a leading role as they don't own the ground. I will now follow this up with Ian as to his views moving forwards. Again an example of us involving members and raising their views. Sarge knows of another matter he's raised where we have done this as this is what OxVox is here to do represent members' views. Please do contact us if there's something you'd like us to raise Glad to hear IL is in favour.....mind you IF he was to TALK to Mick Brown , club sec, who is assumably 'in charge' of paperwork, on the subject he wouldve (shouldve perhaps) been able to gain access to the reams of information regarding supporters views on safe standing, including the Brookes University findings (which was carried out on behalf of OUFC as part of a graduate course ) that were actually carried out by OUFC , along with the involvement of some supporters & input from FSF too, only a couple of years ago under Kelvin Thomas' tenure as OUFC chairman.......which begs the question on OUFC's current board/club admin is the..... right hand actually aware of what the left hand has already done ( recently) ....hope that bit of info help in Oxvox moving IL forward on safe standing (if memory serves there was a huge thread at the time re safe standing, OUFCs input etc on this very forum too....... not being very technical on the ways of locating older threads, I cant go & provide the links however a thread started on 25thMarch 2011 and also a (hot topic) thread started 13 April 2011, both with 'safe standing' in the subject/topic line will throw a lot more light on the subject ) EDIT- Ha, I have managed to get the link back to the thread of 13 april 2011....which does containt relevant information including OUFCs own 'safe standing 'survey'as carried out by Brookes Uni as part of a course- yellowsforum.proboards.com/thread/1311/fsfs-safe-standing-petition .....hopefully having the information from that 3 page long thread alone will save some time on the subject between Oxvox & IL ?
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Post by sihath on Feb 26, 2014 11:56:54 GMT
OK. So what realistic, tangible things do fans want the YA to do. Not things that OxVox already do, or are the 'appropriate' organisation to deal with, but things that fans think will improve the matchday atmosphere, that can be implemented quickly. 1. Tell us what the split is on the bar. Seems they are "running things" in there now? Apart from that..... everything else I can think of comes under Oxvox & the Clubs remit. Re-open the Priory. Allow unreserved seating. Push for safe standing. Think before they price Cup tickets. Re-introduce the "First Cup game free" on the ST. That`ll do for me as a start..... Can the YA also find out what split of revenues the club get from beers sales at the Blackbird, the Bowlplex, what they used to get from the Priory? The 12th Man bar is the only place that the club benefit from. No one is forcing anyone to drink there. Is there a % split that people would find acceptable before they would drink there? 20/80 in favour of the StadCo? 50/50? What would encourage people to drink there (assuming they don't already)?
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Post by sarge on Feb 26, 2014 12:16:39 GMT
IN the main it makes sense...BUT....the Ultras go about their business and are self funded for the multitude of flag/banner displays etc ( although less than they seemed to before of late)....they have NO agenda other than to fanatically promote OUFC on matchdays, and more power to them too I say....as they dont claim to represent anyone other than themselves.....unlike Yellow Army, who stated intent to improve the matchday experience & atmosphere I support....though in a previous post on this thread, Ive voiced MY perspective on why I feel the matchday experience (and atmosphere) this season is at an all time low.....( for the record Ive been supporting Oxford United since just after the name change from Headington United...first game Home to Bath Cityin the southern league, we lost 3-1!)......IF Yellow Army were autonomous (as the Ultras are) no problem wit that.....however, from the outside looking in....the demise/forcing out of 12th Man with Yellow Army immediately taking up the fundraising role doesnt seem quite right or straightforward......Im still awaiting an answer to several questions posed including.... where & how does Charlie Methven, ( who IS involved on the OUFC club administration) fit in? ....... is he a stooge for the board to maintain control over YA ensuring they toe the party line ( like giving their unconditional support to a bar that IS clearly NOT in reality 'good' for OUFC supporters for many reasons.... yes including the MYSTERY percentage split!!!)...& maybe he reports back to the board on anything that YA may want to try & achieve? .....I may be wrong & way off the mark on this but,as Metheven has arrived 'on the scene' in the past few seasons, coinciding with the current Board taking up the reigns,(hmmmmm).... with his clear involvement on the OUFC Administration ( youth set up Im told), Im suspicious, cynic that I am, that its a bit too coincidental!!!.......... as an aside, whats Charlie Methven's background, is he a season ticket holder, how long has he been an Oxford United supporter, does he travel to awaydays on minibuses arranged by mates? the list of questions unanswered on that score is endless isnt it?...... whereas the 'credentials' of Mark Sennett & Joe Nicholls as OUFC supporters are well known ( as were those of Trevor Lambert) re YA/ Oxvox....I agree there is the potential for a crossover of interests & that there maybe should be a representative of Oxvox involved to a degree, however Im not so sure that the Oxvox rep' to YA should be the Oxvox chairman.... though that is more of a point of debate for the Oxvox membership to decide I think ( Im a member of Oxvox) So why is it the minute 12th man ( who were fundraising for the club) are forced out.....Yellow Army merchandise is about to appear? hmmmm, another 'coincidence' that doesnt seem quite right to me As Ive said in previous posts on this thread Ive huge respect for anyone who has the time & desire to put in to improving the lot of OUFC supporters....however...once anyone goes beyond, (the way the Ultras (for example) go about things), being autonomous .... & if there is a claim to represent ALL (OUFC) fans/supporters IMO there should be accountability, because if some claims to represent my interests on my behalf, I like to have the chance, should things be progressing in a way Im not happy with, to be able to voice an opinion. Sarge, why not ask Charlie at the next game what his background supporting Oxford is. If you need to know what he looks like, google "Charlie Methven" look at the images, he's always around the 12th Man Bar before matches, and I'm sure he'll reassure you he's a genuine Oxford fan, with his own "credentials" just like the rest of us. The implication that he's a stooge for the board is wide of the mark, and I think reflects badly on you. I remember Junior getting on his high horse when some of us went on Soccer AM as the fans of the week. 6 season ticket holders, and 2 non-ST but regular attenders. But because he didn't recognise or know more than 2 or 3 of us, he didn't think we were "real" Oxford fans. We have fans from all walks of life, all ages, who all enjoy supporting the club in their own ways. No one is being forced to wear a YA uniform or pledge allegiance to the flag. The phrase "we're ALL the Yellow army" is right. I'm sure if you asked Joe nicely he'd be happy to change any merchandise to say "We're the Yellow Army - except Sarge" LOL! I know Im cynical & suspicious, hence I do and will ask questions on many subjects... however I am always open to be convinced that any of my (cynical) views are wrong maybe the Charlie Methvan coincidences ARE just that, coincidences ? Ive already made my position re 12th man/supporters/ yellow army/ mystery percentages bar clear in that I wont use it after giving it several tries earlier in the season....I DO like to have a ciggy with my pre match beer, & sadly that is not pemitted to be done simultaneously.... however if Charlie Methven fancies a beer n chat at the Blackbird before any home game I'll buy the first round, the Blackbird is full of Oxford United supporters so he'll be among friends/fellow supporters And youre right of course re.no-one knowing every fellow Us supporter ......
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Post by sihath on Feb 26, 2014 12:51:57 GMT
OK. So what realistic, tangible things do fans want the YA to do. Not things that OxVox already do, or are the 'appropriate' organisation to deal with, but things that fans think will improve the matchday atmosphere, that can be implemented quickly. 1. Tell us what the split is on the bar. Seems they are "running things" in there now?Apart from that..... everything else I can think of comes under Oxvox & the Clubs remit. Re-open the Priory. Allow unreserved seating. Push for safe standing. Think before they price Cup tickets. Re-introduce the "First Cup game free" on the ST. That`ll do for me as a start..... How will that improve the atmosphere at games? If they know and if they were to announce what split we get, from what is a "commercially sensitive" agreement, would the atmosphere suddenly improve?
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Post by essexyellows on Feb 26, 2014 13:05:12 GMT
It would be a starting point for people to make an informed choice..... whats to hide?
That aside.... atmosphere starts with the product on the pitch... no more, no less & not the other way around...... do I really want somebody waving a smelly nylon flag in my face to "improve the atmosphere" ? No thanks.
Do I want to wave a piece of coloured card over my head like some sort of special needs type in a sensory experience? No thanks.
Turn up, meet my mates, have a drink, watch a decent game and go home.
I`m not expecting anything over complicated or planned...... football is spontaneous!
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Post by sihath on Feb 26, 2014 13:10:10 GMT
It would be a starting point for people to make an informed choice..... whats to hide? That aside.... atmosphere starts with the product on the pitch... no more, no less & not the other way around...... do I really want somebody waving a smelly nylon flag in my face to "improve the atmosphere" ? No thanks. Do I want to wave a piece of coloured card over my head like some sort of special needs type in a sensory experience? No thanks. Turn up, meet my mates, have a drink, watch a decent game and go home. I`m not expecting anything over complicated or planned...... football is spontaneous! Providing the place you drink lets you know the detail of a private business agreement regarding how much of the revenue Oxford United receive? Sounds over complicated to me.
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Post by Gary Baldi on Feb 26, 2014 13:21:53 GMT
OK. So what realistic, tangible things do fans want the YA to do. Not things that OxVox already do, or are the 'appropriate' organisation to deal with, but things that fans think will improve the matchday atmosphere, that can be implemented quickly. The only way things can change is if people stop bitching and start contributing. Has anyone asked why the club bar sells the lager/cider it does?
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Post by John Lennon on Feb 26, 2014 13:48:28 GMT
Sarge, Charlie Methven is a fan, just like I am. He is a season ticket holder, and helps the club voluntarily. He isn't paid by the club. He is a decent bloke, and I'm glad he is involved in what we are doing as fans.
On the subject of safe standing, it's difficult because of stadium ownership issues. An email from an Oxford fan, who knows those involved in the safe standing campaign, is being followed up. Mark, as chairman of OxVox, explained the situation from a trust point of view.
For the record, I am right behind the safe standing campaign, and will look into it further.
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Post by sarge on Feb 26, 2014 14:22:21 GMT
Here you go JL ....this will save YA going over ground already covered (inc BY OUFC albeit under Kelvin Thomas) .... yellowsforum.proboards.com/thread/1311/fsfs-safe-standing-petition ....this link is above in this thread too as well as archived on this forum from 3 years ago!!!! it contains an abundance of relevant information re Oxford supporters, survey results and the like regarding safe standing at Oxford Utd, if you have ILs ear ask him why Mick Brown hasnt already informed him about what as previously taken place on the subject of safe standing.....Idve though OUFC club sec should have informed IL about this already, although it seems not....maybe he faxed it? ? Also JL can you clear up a few things for me re YA please? Can you catagorically assure that no-one involved in YA has been asked to adhere to/ made to comply with 'charterhouse rules' style secrecy,( whatever is discussed in this room cannot be repeated outside this room), on ANY subject by anyone from/on/ involved with OUFC Administration? Can you inform who is responsible for the totally innapropriate (for football) choice of pre match & half time 'music' ? & why is it belted out a such a volume that any atmosphere created by YA is thus drowned out? If there is a 50/50 tie on any decision within the YA set up, who has the casting vote/ makes the final decision? ( eg. if a decision was needed to be made on how any revenue raised was to be spent) cheers
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Post by bazzer9461 on Feb 26, 2014 14:30:13 GMT
Read it again SOMEONE mentioned earlier this statement was preceded by JL. Was that someone a YA stakeholder? Or just someone? No someone on here if you care to check the thread!!!!
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Post by bazzer9461 on Feb 26, 2014 14:32:19 GMT
I broadly agree with Sarge and EssexYellows. What I would say though, the issue of Safe Standing, I don't think this is the Yellow Army's place to be pushing, but OxVox, this is where you should be making all the noises. Obviously there are major hurdles to clear, but this is what I would like my supporters' group talking about. Perhaps making the case to Stad Co about the benenfits for a dual-sport stadium to be flexible. Another point Sarge makes is The Priory. It just cannot be underestimated how much this added to the matchday experience. Think back to the Swindon game for example, the place was packed solid and crackling with atmosphere. Yellow Army once again, not sure how much sway they would hold, but OxVox? Another thing I would hope you are talking to the relevant parties about. This is half the problem to many groups, Amalgamate and become one voice. It will be a lot easier.
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Post by bazzer9461 on Feb 26, 2014 17:52:11 GMT
Charlie is a massive Oxford fan. He's a life long supporter who cares passionately about the club. But Sarge, anyone who volunteers their time to do things for the Yellow Army is gonna be a dedicated fan, surely? The YA is making things happen through a bunch of fans - it's that simple. It's all about raising money that'll help the club and alongside that trying to find ways to make the best of the shite stadium we've been landed with. We all loved the Priory, but it's gone. I like a beer in town, but regardless of where people choose to go before and after a match the supporters bar can only be a good thing. Let's face it around 300 people out of a 5,000 gate go in there - so it's there for people that want it, but will never be for all. I get the preference to go to a proper boozer. No one will ever be able to turn it into a pub. But decking it out with Oxford United posters, getting former players in as guests, doing the man of the match in there, selling 50/50 tickets and a cut of the bar finally going to the club has got to be better than what it was before. It's making the best of it. When the YA say every United fan is part of the YA, I think it means we're all United fans together. We're one and United. It's the fans, the heart beat of the club. No one has to sign a form, or wear a t-shirt, it's who we are, because we are all Oxford United. There's some good things going on that the YA are doing - embrace it, it's for the good of our club and might make going to the Kashscam a bit more bearable along the way. Modern football will never be what we had in the old days at the Manor, but some of the away days are still decent and the odd home game. Too right we only had to turn up back then. But times have changed. Sadly. But the fact we can make a difference to the club via fans merchandise ideas and fans own projects is great. That's actually part of why I love Oxford United. Imagine supporting Chelsea and asking the club to do a party where the fans ans players mingle, or designing a mug or badge and flogging it to help the club - or being able to chat to a player 20 minutes after the match.....no chance. The intimacy that we loved about the Manor still exists at Oxford United, if you scratch beneath the surface. You have written a good post Langansshinpads and in principle every thing you say about the fans and YA is right, But lets have just one body covering all the issues concerning the fans and the club. Nothing worse than oxvox,12th man or YA coming out with different information, So if the12th man have finished, Then lets have one voice, Ask the club if the YA can hold the meetings at the club, invite a member of the board to be present, Then we would be transparent and hopefully the board will be the same, Could even present the board with the topics to be discussed so as they could be prepared to get involved.
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Post by essexyellows on Feb 26, 2014 18:49:32 GMT
Turn up, meet my mates, have a drink, watch a decent game and go home. I`m not expecting anything over complicated or planned...... football is spontaneous! Providing the place you drink lets you know the detail of a private business agreement regarding how much of the revenue Oxford United receive? Sounds over complicated to me. The "Bar" is being pitched as a pseudo supporters club so, like the old one at the Manor, it would be nice to know how much difference it makes to my club. I KNOW if I drink in the Bird OUFC get diddly squat. If I was informed that my club receive (speculative figure coming) 20p from every £1 spent in the "Bar" I might be prepared to suffer the crap service and below average drinks menu. If however, as many suspect, the club are getting pennys and the OGB is coining in the profit then I would rather use other places. See how it works ? Not complicated. Its basic engagement with the fanbase....... if its a decent deal and was common knowledge more people would use it and it would grow.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2014 11:31:14 GMT
It would be a starting point for people to make an informed choice..... whats to hide? That aside.... atmosphere starts with the product on the pitch... no more, no less & not the other way around...... do I really want somebody waving a smelly nylon flag in my face to "improve the atmosphere" ? No thanks. Do I want to wave a piece of coloured card over my head like some sort of special needs type in a sensory experience? No thanks. Turn up, meet my mates, have a drink, watch a decent game and go home. I`m not expecting anything over complicated or planned...... football is spontaneous! Hate this. Do the players make the atmosphere? Why is there sometimes a cracking atmosphere and singing prior to kick off when there's no 'product on the pitch' yet? Because it's the fans who make the atmosphere, not the players. Winning and losing can often dictate atmospheres, but that says more about the attitude of our fans than anything else. There are lots of clubs who keep their atmospheres going for the full 90 regardless of what's happening on the pitch, I wish we were one of them. I'd take a "smelly nylon flag" in the face because someone is at least being enthusiastic in the stands and improving the visual aspect inside the ground, which in turn could raise an atmosphere. Good on them I say.
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Post by Mark Sennett on Feb 27, 2014 12:48:12 GMT
I’ve spoken to Charlie, and he thinks this query is more than fair enough and deserves a full answer. There is no secret about it. His position is not with the football club itself, but as Trustee of the Oxford United Youth and Community Trust. This is a voluntary, unpaid role, which has to be filled for the YCT charitable status. Broadly, it means keeping an eye on the Academy, the Women's set-up and the Community work of the club. As a lifelong fan whose family have been supporting the club for 60 years or more, he sees the role as a privilege. Compared to relevant executive members of the club and academy staff - Gerald Kelly; Richey Blackmore; Les Taylor; Chris Allen etc – he wouldn’t claim to be a major part of things... but he has chosen to interpret part of the role (ie community) as being to try to help bring the Oxford United family back together a bit, after decades of what we have all found distressing fracture, alienation and antagonism (sometimes necessary, sometimes not). For those who remember the days of players, fans and directors drinking in the social club after the game at the Manor, this is a big deal and part of the platform needed to take our beloved club onto the next level. Part of what Charlie has been doing has been trying to help members of the club staff link to supporters to ensure that those at the club as well-informed as possible, about the club’s history and its supporters. Things like getting old players back to the club to speak to fans at home games. He has spent a lot of time with Gerald Kelly and Tony Davison, who have both been on a steep learning curve about OUFC after joining shortly before the start of the season. Part of it has been trying to help bring fans together, as all of us believe that we should all be working together in harmony. As many will know, Charlie used to be a regular poster on this forum – under the handle Charliesghost - but he no longer posts, as he feels it doesn't 'fit' with his position, however humble that position is. Not every fan knows Charlie, but many do, as he was involved with FOUL and the early days of OxVox, as well as having been on various fundraising walks or playing in 6-a-sides/ for OxVox. Put it this way: he hardly hides away from other fans! On a personal note, I think it’s great to see the club trying to rediscover itself. Whether it be through the ex-players in and around the club – Rosie; Melville; Lewis; Les Taylor; Chrissy Allen; Jeremy Charles; Les Phillips; Alan Judge – or whether it be through lifelong supporters like Charlie having some sort of role, it all shows that the Lenagans, unlike previous Boards, have a feel for what makes a professional sports club work. This should be no surprise, as they regenerated Wigan Rugby League Club in the same way. On a final note, if anyone wants to speak to Charlie about anything, he’s usually having a pint in the 12th Man Bar before a game or in the Headington Bar after the game. Or else watching a youth team game.
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Post by SteMerritt on Feb 27, 2014 13:00:28 GMT
Mr Sennett, whilst you are about, would you care to comment on this (taken from Yellow Voice Forum). The italicised part is taken from an Oxford Mail piece from Monday, and below that the type of comment being added to this by forum members...
"We did receive a response from Mark Sennett, chairman of OxVox, which is part of the Yellow Army, on behalf of the group. This was given to us on Friday afternoon but a production error meant it was omitted from the final print version and we apologise for this mistake."
Well this appeared in Mondays Oxford Mail it does appear that Oxvox is indeed part of the Yellow Army and therefore no longer independent.
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Post by ox44xp on Feb 27, 2014 13:19:22 GMT
Hang on, I thought the problem was that Yellow Army was part of OxVox and therefore was not independent and influenced by the evil lizard overlords.
If it is the case that OxVox is now part of Yellow Army, then does this mean we have actually won back control and it is OxVox that is now the puppet ?
Or have the Oxford Fail simply balls up ..... again!
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Post by Mark Sennett on Feb 27, 2014 13:42:35 GMT
No problem. OxVox is very much independent of OUFC and examples I listed earlier on in this thread.
OxVox endorses the work of yellow army and some of the committee are happy to take part in yellow army events. Joe and I are obviously heavily involved. Yellow Army is open to all and OxVox is happy to support what it stands for. But OxVox aren't part of the yellow army per se.
Yellow army focuses on fundraising and match day atmosphere and OxVox is happy to support those concepts. But OxVox exists to represent members' views and raise concerns to the club of which we've been pretty busy doing recently!
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