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Post by essexyellows on Feb 25, 2014 14:51:42 GMT
All spot on Sarge.
One club with one accountable body representing the fans.
So what is the mythical bar figure then? Seems its common knowledge amongst those at the top table who have been "selected to represent me" as an OUFC fan.
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Post by sarge on Feb 25, 2014 15:06:09 GMT
If those holding 'official' positions are ELECTED to represent MY interests thats one thing....if they are not accountable,as in APPOINTED, that means Ive had no choice in having a say who is representing ME..... so, cynic that I am, maybe said appointed 'officials' ( not those who volunteer to help with activities BTW)will have more of a loyalty to the interests of person(s)/ organisation who appointed them to 'power' over actually looking out for the genuine interests of Oxford United supporters ? ACCOUNTABILITY is important IMO So who is accountable for elections? Does the YA need elections? Does this mean a more formal structure is needed? Why aren't the clubs best intentions at heart? One could argue the 12th man didn't have the clubs best intentions at heart, but that I think is unfair. I believe you can accountable and unelected, but it requires people to ask open, honest and non-prejudicial questions. With the high profile of the YA, they can't afford to be doing anything that is dodgy. I doubt that is people's intentions, and the club wouldn't want to associate with that. The issue is some people are biased from the get go and won't like the answers given because they want to believe certain things. I respect your beliefs BUT disagree Gary Baldi...... if individuals representing ME are appointed by someone instead of elected,what if I along with many others take issue with the way they are 'represting' my interests, what could I do about it to change the situation? Nothing! which IMO is wrong on many levels.... AND well yes, now theres a point in question, just WHO did appoint /hand pick Yellow Army 'officials'...a question that I WOULD like answering OUFC Club Administration employees (including players, managers, board members etc) are transient, and will have a different outlook & approach on many things to that of its fans ( Charlton cup match replay ticket prices as an example)....Supporters (in general) tend to be forever faithful to their team, hence why I believe that ANY supporters group/organisation should be INDEPENDENT of the Club administration, and also its officials should be elected, therefore accountable. After all, IF a non elected person continually avoids or refuses to answer valid questions how is it possible to rectify that situation if there is no accountability?
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Post by ox44xp on Feb 25, 2014 15:24:57 GMT
$64,000 question.
There is an election for Yellow Army committee tomorrow.
Who on here will stand?
Me - No.
Who else?
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Post by Mark Sennett on Feb 25, 2014 15:32:12 GMT
As I said once things are in place I think there's no reason to not hold an election that's my view. But I will say that then gives ownership of the group to individuals and 12th man never went down this route for this reason and that's why we haven't its a volunteers network. As we are finding at OxVox elections are a lot of work too!
Also it might blur the lines between OxVox and yellow army as OxVox is the one independent and democratic organisation.
On the bar if imagine its a percentage of profits over a fixed amount but as said before negotiations went on for a long long time and the club won't release the final details due to commercial sensitivity
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Post by Gary Baldi on Feb 25, 2014 15:39:38 GMT
So who is accountable for elections? Does the YA need elections? Does this mean a more formal structure is needed? Why aren't the clubs best intentions at heart? One could argue the 12th man didn't have the clubs best intentions at heart, but that I think is unfair. I believe you can accountable and unelected, but it requires people to ask open, honest and non-prejudicial questions. With the high profile of the YA, they can't afford to be doing anything that is dodgy. I doubt that is people's intentions, and the club wouldn't want to associate with that. The issue is some people are biased from the get go and won't like the answers given because they want to believe certain things. I respect your beliefs BUT disagree Gary Baldi...... if individuals representing ME are appointed by someone instead of elected,what if I along with many others take issue with the way they are 'represting' my interests, what could I do about it to change the situation? Nothing! which IMO is wrong on many levels.... AND well yes, now theres a point in question, just WHO did appoint /hand pick Yellow Army 'officials'...a question that I WOULD like answering OUFC Club Administration employees (including players, managers, board members etc) are transient, and will have a different outlook & approach on many things to that of its fans ( Charlton cup match replay ticket prices as an example)....Supporters (in general) tend to be forever faithful to their team, hence why I believe that ANY supporters group/organisation should be INDEPENDENT of the Club administration, and also its officials should be elected, therefore accountable. After all, IF a non elected person continually avoids or refuses to answer valid questions how is it possible to rectify that situation if there is no accountability? I see your point but I think we are looking at it far too deeply. I'd suggest speaking to the people involved face to face at the next game - online is always awkward IMHO. I saw JL in the East Stand at the last home game for instance. I'm sure the YA people would be happy to do that. Are the YA suggesting they represent your interests? I can't say I've paid minute attention to it all but I've never assumed that I am being represented by them in any way. I can choose to participate or not and I can choose to donate or not. We have OxVox who are the supporters group and despite the finger jabbing from the few, I don't see any evidence to them being in hock with the club. They may agree on a lot of stuff but that doesn't mean they are in a cosy club.
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Post by sihath on Feb 25, 2014 15:41:28 GMT
I wonder sometime why people bother trying to improve the "matchday experience" after seeing the amount of grief they must get.
No-one is forced to hand over money to the Yellow Army (I know there's the £1 for non ST holders) but you can drink in the bowlplex, so that's voluntary.
No one is demanding payment from you to be an Oxford fan, so we can all just carry on supporting the club in our own ways exactly as before. If you want to drink in the club bars, you can. If you won't until you know exactly how much the club get then you're free to carry on exactly as before.
Why do we need elections for people who just want to do something positive for the club/fans. I've offered my services to Joe if he wants any t-shirt designs, etc. as have others. Should I/we be vetted/elected before any of these designs go on sale?
Of course there's nothing to stop anyone setting up their own elected/non-elected/dictatorship/organisation/lobbying group called whatever they want, then they can have exactly what they want in terms of rules/elections etc.
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Post by langansshinpads on Feb 25, 2014 16:20:12 GMT
OxVox do all the lobbying and raising important issues with the club - for example Charlton ticket prices for the home game this season was a topic Oxvox took up with the club on behalf of its members and the argument was presented to the club and discussed. Oxvox is different to the YA. It requires a committee and a voting system.
I don't think the YA does. It's objectives are clear. And from that basis point fans are being welcomed to join in, if they wish - in small or large measure. Just like the 12th Man did - they had a forum by which fans could make contact with ideas and if they were a goer could then make them happen with the guidance and support of fellow fans. That's the beauty of it - it's organic. Surely if it was run by a committee it would be all the things that make it too official.
The YA, for example, consulted the club on the merchandise prior to ordering it - simply to ensure it did not massively clash with anything the club shop are doing. Fans then have a choice as to whether they purchase the products, just as they do as to whether they want to visit the bar. And we can all do so safe in the knowledge that the profits will help key areas of the club, promptly.
The YA has set up an email address, which Oxford fans are welcomed to send ideas and suggestions to - every idea is discussed and if it's viable taken on. I don't see the need to over complicate it. The YA is independent of the club and Oxvox. It has different objectives and operating methods to Oxvox. Secondly it, of course, has to work with the club, but goes to the club with fans ideas that it thinks will work.
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Post by sarge on Feb 25, 2014 16:30:11 GMT
I respect your beliefs BUT disagree Gary Baldi...... if individuals representing ME are appointed by someone instead of elected,what if I along with many others take issue with the way they are 'represting' my interests, what could I do about it to change the situation? Nothing! which IMO is wrong on many levels.... AND well yes, now theres a point in question, just WHO did appoint /hand pick Yellow Army 'officials'...a question that I WOULD like answering OUFC Club Administration employees (including players, managers, board members etc) are transient, and will have a different outlook & approach on many things to that of its fans ( Charlton cup match replay ticket prices as an example)....Supporters (in general) tend to be forever faithful to their team, hence why I believe that ANY supporters group/organisation should be INDEPENDENT of the Club administration, and also its officials should be elected, therefore accountable. After all, IF a non elected person continually avoids or refuses to answer valid questions how is it possible to rectify that situation if there is no accountability? I see your point but I think we are looking at it far too deeply. I'd suggest speaking to the people involved face to face at the next game - online is always awkward IMHO. I saw JL in the East Stand at the last home game for instance. I'm sure the YA people would be happy to do that. Are the YA suggesting they represent your interests? I can't say I've paid minute attention to it all but I've never assumed that I am being represented by them in any way. I can choose to participate or not and I can choose to donate or not. We have OxVox who are the supporters group and despite the finger jabbing from the few, I don't see any evidence to them being in hock with the club. They may agree on a lot of stuff but that doesn't mean they are in a cosy club. Im a natural cynic hence my way of looking at people being hand picked as opposed to elected....and yes somewhere at at some point when Yellow Army first were created there was a post claiming they (YA) represent the interests of ALL supporters....fair play to anyone who puts time & effort into something they are passionate about, however, if what they are doing with the best intentions, falls out of step with the people they say they represent...if they are not accountable, then how can those who are dissafected 'voice' an opinion, as in change things? ......WHO was it behind creating Yellow Army? ( Im not aware of anyone who has actually been officially credited with putting it together).....and WHO or WHOM appointed the Yellow Army 'officials .... ( and for that matter WHY?.... when we already had the democratic independent voice of OUFC supporters in Oxvox .... ( yes Im I paid up member of Oxvox)...who I think do a decentish job under difficult circumstances( & we also had 12th man as fundraisers too)..... IMO I think (albeit cynically)that having the elected chairman of Oxvox as an 'official'of Yellow Army MAY be a way of 'compromising' Oxvox's independence? .....after all under the current OUFC Administration, the public schoolesque application of 'charterhouse rules' ( nothing discussed on this subject can be repeated outside of this room) style secrecy, so Im told ,is absolutely rife!!! Which could mean that the appointed (non accountable) 'officials' of Yellow Army, have perhaps been involved in agreements of that kind? ( hmmmm, what actual percentage of profit does the club receive from bar take in the 12th Man Bar/Yellow Army Bar? 'its sensitive' is basically all thats come out on the subject thus far..... HAS there been a 'silencing' of those party to that information I wonder? ).... back to the likelihood or not of 'Charterhouse rules' involving Yellow Army officials on ANY subject, if it is true, firstly its wrong, secondly those 'agreeing' to be bound by that kind of hamstringing, are thus failing in part in representing 'fellow' supporters, instead they are collaborating in dishing out the mushroom treatment ( keep em in the dark & feed em shit)..... Maybe my cynical nature can make me view too many situations suspiciously ...... however, if theres nothing to hide and straight answers to straight questions are given, theres nothing to fear by those providing the answers.....IF underhand agreements of silence have been given, then hey,then maybe my natural cynicism isnt such a bad thing?
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Post by sarge on Feb 25, 2014 16:38:52 GMT
OxVox do all the lobbying and raising important issues with the club - for example Charlton ticket prices for the home game this season was a topic Oxvox took up with the club on behalf of its members and the argument was presented to the club and discussed. Oxvox is different to the YA. It requires a committee and a voting system. I don't think the YA does. It's objectives are clear. And from that basis point fans are being welcomed to join in, if they wish - in small or large measure. Just like the 12th Man did - they had a forum by which fans could make contact with ideas and if they were a goer could then make them happen with the guidance and support of fellow fans. That's the beauty of it - it's organic. Surely if it was run by a committee it would be all the things that make it too official. The YA, for example, consulted the club on the merchandise prior to ordering it - simply to ensure it did not massively clash with anything the club shop are doing. Fans then have a choice as to whether they purchase the products, just as they do as to whether they want to visit the bar. And we can all do so safe in the knowledge that the profits will help key areas of the club, promptly. The YA has set up an email address, which Oxford fans are welcomed to send ideas and suggestions to - every idea is discussed and if it's viable taken on. I don't see the need to over complicate it. The YA is independent of the club and Oxvox. It has different objectives and operating methods to Oxvox. Secondly it, of course, has to work with the club, but goes to the club with fans ideas that it thinks will work. is YA Independent of the club? is it really?....WHO appointed the 'officials in the first place? ....And if YA is truly independent,can you let me know how does Charlie Methevan , who in some capacity IS involved on the OUFC Administration side of things ( youth set up?), fit in as an 'official of YA ?.... As for YA merchandise etc....hmmmm, wasnt fundraising, inc merchandise the 'remit' of 12th Man...who DO appear to have been 'forced out' in the past week...... coinciding neatly, too neatly maybe,with the arrival of YA merchandise ? YA looks a bit too much like it is far from independent to me, cynic that I am
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Post by John Lennon on Feb 25, 2014 17:55:48 GMT
Sarge, let me give you my thoughts on the YA, and try to answer some of your points.
The Yellow Army has often been used to describe Oxford fans. Last summer, after 3 years of trying to improve the atmosphere with the Ultimate Support Days, I knew I needed to do more to make a difference, and did a lot of thinking as we needed something bigger and better. My idea was, to bring all fans together under one banner, the Yellow Army. This included OxVox and the 12th Man, to improve communication, and to help unite fans as the Yellow Army. This lead to myself, Mark Sennett, Trevor Lambert, and Charlie Methven, all supporters and season ticket holders, working together to try and improve things for supporters, and to promote the United We Stand message that the club had. This was my idea, and no one involved has been handpicked by the club. We are independent, and the club have no say in how we as the fans do things. We do have a good relationship with the club, but we are not yes men as has been suggested. It's important for the fans and football club to have a good relationship, as long as things are done the right way.
The idea of the Yellow Army, is to unite fans and the club, and to do what we all can to improve match days and raise funds to help us do that, as well as be able to support the club, with the youth and community trust an important part of that. Clubs that get promoted are often united, and pulling in the same direction. I hope that is something we can help with.
I don't agree that anyone who gets involved in the Yellow Army needs to be elected. We don't represent anyone, but are just fans trying to make a difference. Whether you are part of the YA working group, or you are an Oxford fans living the other side of the world, we are the same. There is no leadership or any extra importance because you are part of the YA working group. As Oxford fans, we are all in it together, and I hope more people get involved, so we can make a difference for every Oxford fan and our football club. We can be held to account by fellow Oxford fans at any time. Things should be done right, and as supporters, we need to make sure that is happening.
OxVox are the supporters trust, who represent members. This is very different from the YA. I never wanted the YA to be a supporters group. For me, it's the fans, not a group. Anyone can get involved, and fans can chip in and help where they can. It's about all working together as fans of our football club.
The 12th Man group walked away from what we are trying to do. That was disappointing, especially as the 12th Man group have closed the initiative. I do not agree with that decision, but I went to 3 12th Man committee meetings, and I have nothing bad to say about any of those involved. I am glad 3 of the 12th Man group have decided to keep working with the YA.
For the record, I don't know the revenue share in the bars. I've been told it's a good deal for all parties, but I don't know any supporter who knows the exact details.
I am a passionate fan, who cares a lot about the football club we support, and If I can make a difference, to unite the fans, and to make the experience of supporting our football club better, then I want to do it. Trying to improve the atmosphere in our soulless stadium is a big challenge, and quite soul destroying at times when the efforts go to waste. But with the help of fellow fans in the YA, I will keep trying until we succeed. The biggest role the Yellow Army can play, is coming to matches, and as one, getting behind the team, and being positive, so we have the best chance of success.
The criticism and abuse that i've read and heard in the last few days has been disappointing, as we are trying to do the right thing, and I hope what I've posted answers a few questions that people might have.
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Post by bazzer9461 on Feb 25, 2014 18:04:18 GMT
If those holding 'official' positions are ELECTED to represent MY interests thats one thing....if they are not accountable,as in APPOINTED, that means Ive had no choice in having a say who is representing ME..... so, cynic that I am, maybe said appointed 'officials' ( not those who volunteer to help with activities BTW)will have more of a loyalty to the interests of person(s)/ organisation who appointed them to 'power' over actually looking out for the genuine interests of Oxford United supporters ? ACCOUNTABILITY is important IMO So who is accountable for elections? Does the YA need elections? Does this mean a more formal structure is needed? Why aren't the clubs best intentions at heart? One could argue the 12th man didn't have the clubs best intentions at heart, but that I think is unfair. I believe you can accountable and unelected, but it requires people to ask open, honest and non-prejudicial questions. With the high profile of the YA, they can't afford to be doing anything that is dodgy. I doubt that is people's intentions, and the club wouldn't want to associate with that. The issue is some people are biased from the get go and won't like the answers given because they want to believe certain things. JL someone mentioned earlier I think this thread that club officials will appoint people to run YA. This wouldn't be democratic, This should be an independent organisation, Organised by the fans, with all the decisions being made by the fans without any outside influence.
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Post by John Lennon on Feb 25, 2014 18:07:07 GMT
I agree with you Bazzer, and that's is how it is, and how it should be. The fans involved have volunteered to do so, and have not been chosen by the club.
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Post by bazzer9461 on Feb 25, 2014 18:07:53 GMT
If those holding 'official' positions are ELECTED to represent MY interests thats one thing....if they are not accountable,as in APPOINTED, that means Ive had no choice in having a say who is representing ME..... so, cynic that I am, maybe said appointed 'officials' ( not those who volunteer to help with activities BTW)will have more of a loyalty to the interests of person(s)/ organisation who appointed them to 'power' over actually looking out for the genuine interests of Oxford United supporters ? ACCOUNTABILITY is important IMO So who is accountable for elections? Does the YA need elections? Does this mean a more formal structure is needed? Why aren't the clubs best intentions at heart? One could argue the 12th man didn't have the clubs best intentions at heart, but that I think is unfair. I believe you can accountable and unelected, but it requires people to ask open, honest and non-prejudicial questions. With the high profile of the YA, they can't afford to be doing anything that is dodgy. I doubt that is people's intentions, and the club wouldn't want to associate with that. The issue is some people are biased from the get go and won't like the answers given because they want to believe certain things. JL someone mentioned earlier I think this thread that club officials will appoint people to run YA. This wouldn't be democratic, This should be an independent organisation, Organised by the fans, with all the decisions being made by the fans without any outside influence. The board who will run YA should be elected, They should not be people already running the YA or the 12th man as a mandatory right to be on the board, but by an election held amongst the supporters, This should be first and foremost for the start of a new fund raising group for OUFC.
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Post by John Lennon on Feb 25, 2014 18:11:41 GMT
No one runs the YA. It's fans who volunteer their time, and every fan is equal. More fans are getting involved, and that's how it should be.
I don't think anyone needs to be elected to be an Oxford fan who wants to volunteer their time to the YA. OxVox is different as the supporters trust, but the 12th Man group didn't have that, and it would over complicate things, when we want to unite the fans, and give everyone a chance to be involved.
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Post by essexyellows on Feb 25, 2014 19:12:48 GMT
You (YA) are taking money...... who is accounting for it?
I also find it VERY difficult to believe that none of the chosen four YA "leaders" know the bar % or split.
You (JL) say above that you didn`t "want a supporters group"....that is exactly what you have made!!
Furthermore you say "There is no leadership or any extra importance because you are part of the YA working group." ? Really? This is Sennett, Methven et al who seem very pro active in using the club to promote their own personal CV`s and agendas.
Just views from afar from an outsider looking in.
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Post by John Lennon on Feb 25, 2014 19:24:29 GMT
The accounts will be done by supporters who have experience in this area. Clearly the numbers need to add up, as we want this done properly.
It was never my intention to set up a new supporters group. If you feel this is the case, then I hope you will see that in time, this isn't the case.
I don't agree at all with what you say about Mark Sennett and Charlie Methven. If I saw evidence of that, I'd be having a word. I speak to them regularly, and I couldn't disagree more
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Post by Gary Baldi on Feb 25, 2014 22:23:35 GMT
So who is accountable for elections? Does the YA need elections? Does this mean a more formal structure is needed? Why aren't the clubs best intentions at heart? One could argue the 12th man didn't have the clubs best intentions at heart, but that I think is unfair. I believe you can accountable and unelected, but it requires people to ask open, honest and non-prejudicial questions. With the high profile of the YA, they can't afford to be doing anything that is dodgy. I doubt that is people's intentions, and the club wouldn't want to associate with that. The issue is some people are biased from the get go and won't like the answers given because they want to believe certain things. JL someone mentioned earlier I think this thread that club officials will appoint people to run YA. This wouldn't be democratic, This should be an independent organisation, Organised by the fans, with all the decisions being made by the fans without any outside influence. The board who will run YA should be elected, They should not be people already running the YA or the 12th man as a mandatory right to be on the board, but by an election held amongst the supporters, This should be first and foremost for the start of a new fund raising group for OUFC. What are you prattling on about? JL has never mentioned that, not for the 12th Man. I don't know where people got this from. I've always been of the understanding that the fans did it for the fans to improve things. Some people decided to step up and do something. The club are supporting the effort, but not appointing people to it.
I can't help but see a few fans enjoying agitating things. I don't know why, but they seem to enjoy it.
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Post by bazzer9461 on Feb 25, 2014 22:36:52 GMT
JL someone mentioned earlier I think this thread that club officials will appoint people to run YA. This wouldn't be democratic, This should be an independent organisation, Organised by the fans, with all the decisions being made by the fans without any outside influence. The board who will run YA should be elected, They should not be people already running the YA or the 12th man as a mandatory right to be on the board, but by an election held amongst the supporters, This should be first and foremost for the start of a new fund raising group for OUFC. What are you prattling on about? JL has never mentioned that, not for the 12th Man. I don't know where people got this from. I've always been of the understanding that the fans did it for the fans to improve things. Some people decided to step up and do something. The club are supporting the effort, but not appointing people to it.
I can't help but see a few fans enjoying agitating things. I don't know why, but they seem to enjoy it.
Read it again SOMEONE mentioned earlier this statement was preceded by JL.
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Post by sarge on Feb 25, 2014 22:43:17 GMT
Sarge, let me give you my thoughts on the YA, and try to answer some of your points. The Yellow Army has often been used to describe Oxford fans. Last summer, after 3 years of trying to improve the atmosphere with the Ultimate Support Days, I knew I needed to do more to make a difference, and did a lot of thinking as we needed something bigger and better. My idea was, to bring all fans together under one banner, the Yellow Army. This included OxVox and the 12th Man, to improve communication, and to help unite fans as the Yellow Army. This lead to myself, Mark Sennett, Trevor Lambert, and Charlie Methven, all supporters and season ticket holders, working together to try and improve things for supporters, and to promote the United We Stand message that the club had. This was my idea, and no one involved has been handpicked by the club. We are independent, and the club have no say in how we as the fans do things. We do have a good relationship with the club, but we are not yes men as has been suggested. It's important for the fans and football club to have a good relationship, as long as things are done the right way. The idea of the Yellow Army, is to unite fans and the club, and to do what we all can to improve match days and raise funds to help us do that, as well as be able to support the club, with the youth and community trust an important part of that. Clubs that get promoted are often united, and pulling in the same direction. I hope that is something we can help with. I don't agree that anyone who gets involved in the Yellow Army needs to be elected. We don't represent anyone, but are just fans trying to make a difference. Whether you are part of the YA working group, or you are an Oxford fans living the other side of the world, we are the same. There is no leadership or any extra importance because you are part of the YA working group. As Oxford fans, we are all in it together, and I hope more people get involved, so we can make a difference for every Oxford fan and our football club. We can be held to account by fellow Oxford fans at any time. Things should be done right, and as supporters, we need to make sure that is happening. OxVox are the supporters trust, who represent members. This is very different from the YA. I never wanted the YA to be a supporters group. For me, it's the fans, not a group. Anyone can get involved, and fans can chip in and help where they can. It's about all working together as fans of our football club. The 12th Man group walked away from what we are trying to do. That was disappointing, especially as the 12th Man group have closed the initiative. I do not agree with that decision, but I went to 3 12th Man committee meetings, and I have nothing bad to say about any of those involved. I am glad 3 of the 12th Man group have decided to keep working with the YA. For the record, I don't know the revenue share in the bars. I've been told it's a good deal for all parties, but I don't know any supporter who knows the exact details. I am a passionate fan, who cares a lot about the football club we support, and If I can make a difference, to unite the fans, and to make the experience of supporting our football club better, then I want to do it. Trying to improve the atmosphere in our soulless stadium is a big challenge, and quite soul destroying at times when the efforts go to waste. But with the help of fellow fans in the YA, I will keep trying until we succeed. The biggest role the Yellow Army can play, is coming to matches, and as one, getting behind the team, and being positive, so we have the best chance of success. The criticism and abuse that i've read and heard in the last few days has been disappointing, as we are trying to do the right thing, and I hope what I've posted answers a few questions that people might have. cheers for the lengthy reply JL Just a couple of follow up Qs re the bar share....who told you it was a good deal, and what did the mystery person/persons base their assesment on?...my natural cynisim would automatically kick in and ask the question based on what? Where and how does Charlie Methevan fit in with YA ? I dont have any problem with the aims of YA to improve the atmosphere & matchday experience....however,arguably the best way to improve the matchday experience by far would be the introducton of Safe standing , a subject raised , looked into and 'agreed in principle'by OUFC- under KT's tenure, which seems to have been ignored by the current Administration, which a shame as if it had been continued towards OUFC would have been trailblazing Safe Standing instead of as it is present...not involved whatsoever, even though the safe standing campaign has support from more and more football clubs. But NOT OUFC.... Granted the stadium is not owned by OUFC, nonetheless, a low roofed, 4th stand incorperating rail seating/ safe standing WOULD enhance the matchsday atmosphere 1000%, so would therefore be something that any supporters group/gang/crew/firm/organisation/gathering or Army looking to improve the atmosphere I would have thought be 100% behind? ......nowt on the subject from YA as yet though? Why not? IMO the 'matchday experience' is the worst Ive ever experienced this season......Im 'encouraged' to use a bar thats over priced with limited chioce, where Im NOT allowed to take by overpriced, insipid tasting 'beer' in its wobbly plastic receptacle outside with me to have a ciggy....when I return my overpriced 'beer' has been swiped, assumably by someone fed up with waiting to be served.... all so the club might , on a good matchday 'earn' a massive £20 or thereabouts as their share of the revenue split of bar profits..... I tried it, I dont like it in the 12th yellow supporters bar, I like to have a ciggy with a drink.... Im not a child, I can evidently look after the plastic receptacle with 'beer' in that Ive paid for, considerably better than the self important lanyard wearing suits on one door & the sia licenced 'security' on the main door to the aforementioned bar....as an aside any wonder some feel the need for a ciggy in the toilets inside the stadium?.... WHY am I not permitted to take my overpriced insipid tasting 'beer' in its floppy plastic receptacle outside the bar with me when I want a ciggy? That Im not allowed to smoke & drink at the 'same' time was the cherry on the top as far as the supporters bar goes..wont use it now! A PROPER OUFC supporters club would be ideal....the unofficial supporters club venue for many seasons was the conveniently located... now empty Priory! rip ....where you could smoke and look after/ drink your beer (from a wide range of choices), meet up with friends in the buildup to the match, without having to pay for the privelage of drinking there....IMO the club administration could have, maybe should have & perhaps still could rectify the situation by leasing the Priory ( on favourable terms of course) as OUFC supporters club..... after all Im eliably informed the OUFC current board members do have experience in 'running pubs' with interests in hostelries in Woodstock The pre match and half time 'music' is innapropriate for football IMO ( and invariably too loud for pre match & halftime entertainment).... does it need to be delivered at the volume it is at? its innapropriateness and volume supresses and suffocates any atmosphere that may be starting to build......who chooses the music thats imposed? is it really selected by a long term football fan ....or is the choice down to some college graduate who presumes ( like the Wembley stadium administration) that ALL atmosphere generated by ALL sport fans need to be drowned out by loud music ( as was attempted at the play off final !!!!) And whats with the damn patronising 'announcements' at half time " this is a family stadium , dont use bad language " its actually a more long winded statement/announcement that really winds me up every time I hear it.....words of Anglo Saxon origin have been in common usage by working people in this country for centuries...... being talked down to like that makes me want to shout f*ck OFF in the direction of the announcer ( I do just about manage to resist the temptation as Im in the family stand) So for the first season ever I chose to enter the breeze block stadium about 5 mins before kick off instead of 15 -20 mins before kick off....I choose to have a pre match beer while having a ciggy in the appropriate designated area & meeting up with people at The Blackbird..... theres actually something of a real pre match buzz there pre home games....unlike in the 'supporters bar' where Ive found the atmosphere pre match is as flat as the swill served up at the bars. Uniting all the(OUFC) fans is an admirable aim.... in reality, when the current OUFC Administration seem to be miles away from what Oxford United supporers WANT , Uniting all OUFC fans isnt achievable currently sadly IMO..... any wonder gates are still low? ....away days are so much more fun, like going to support your team should be!, maybe if some of the OUFC Administration went to a few away games with the fans as opposed to fellow employees MAYBE they might, just might have their blinkers removed on what it is fans actually want as the matchday experience, instead of trying to impose ideals that in the main simply and clearly dont work IF you can tell me, assure me, that absolutely and catagorically there has been NO interference, or attempt to lead YA into certain directions, or that YA people havent been asked to/ made to adhere to 'charterhouse rules' on sensitive subjects by anyone involved with or on behalf of OUFC Administration, then I'll take your word on it JL Good luck with YA ....Ive a feeling YA will need all the luck there is the way things stand Though I still feel the there should be ACCOUNTABILITY ....:-)
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Post by oufcyellows on Feb 26, 2014 7:28:12 GMT
Sarge, let me give you my thoughts on the YA, and try to answer some of your points. The Yellow Army has often been used to describe Oxford fans. Last summer, after 3 years of trying to improve the atmosphere with the Ultimate Support Days, I knew I needed to do more to make a difference, and did a lot of thinking as we needed something bigger and better. My idea was, to bring all fans together under one banner, the Yellow Army. This included OxVox and the 12th Man, to improve communication, and to help unite fans as the Yellow Army. This lead to myself, Mark Sennett, Trevor Lambert, and Charlie Methven, all supporters and season ticket holders, working together to try and improve things for supporters, and to promote the United We Stand message that the club had. This was my idea, and no one involved has been handpicked by the club. We are independent, and the club have no say in how we as the fans do things. We do have a good relationship with the club, but we are not yes men as has been suggested. It's important for the fans and football club to have a good relationship, as long as things are done the right way. The idea of the Yellow Army, is to unite fans and the club, and to do what we all can to improve match days and raise funds to help us do that, as well as be able to support the club, with the youth and community trust an important part of that. Clubs that get promoted are often united, and pulling in the same direction. I hope that is something we can help with. I don't agree that anyone who gets involved in the Yellow Army needs to be elected. We don't represent anyone, but are just fans trying to make a difference. Whether you are part of the YA working group, or you are an Oxford fans living the other side of the world, we are the same. There is no leadership or any extra importance because you are part of the YA working group. As Oxford fans, we are all in it together, and I hope more people get involved, so we can make a difference for every Oxford fan and our football club. We can be held to account by fellow Oxford fans at any time. Things should be done right, and as supporters, we need to make sure that is happening. OxVox are the supporters trust, who represent members. This is very different from the YA. I never wanted the YA to be a supporters group. For me, it's the fans, not a group. Anyone can get involved, and fans can chip in and help where they can. It's about all working together as fans of our football club. The 12th Man group walked away from what we are trying to do. That was disappointing, especially as the 12th Man group have closed the initiative. I do not agree with that decision, but I went to 3 12th Man committee meetings, and I have nothing bad to say about any of those involved. I am glad 3 of the 12th Man group have decided to keep working with the YA. For the record, I don't know the revenue share in the bars. I've been told it's a good deal for all parties, but I don't know any supporter who knows the exact details. I am a passionate fan, who cares a lot about the football club we support, and If I can make a difference, to unite the fans, and to make the experience of supporting our football club better, then I want to do it. Trying to improve the atmosphere in our soulless stadium is a big challenge, and quite soul destroying at times when the efforts go to waste. But with the help of fellow fans in the YA, I will keep trying until we succeed. The biggest role the Yellow Army can play, is coming to matches, and as one, getting behind the team, and being positive, so we have the best chance of success. The criticism and abuse that i've read and heard in the last few days has been disappointing, as we are trying to do the right thing, and I hope what I've posted answers a few questions that people might have. cheers for the lengthy reply JL Just a couple of follow up Qs re the bar share....who told you it was a good deal, and what did the mystery person/persons base their assesment on?...my natural cynisim would automatically kick in and ask the question based on what? Where and how does Charlie Methevan fit in with YA ? I dont have any problem with the aims of YA to improve the atmosphere & matchday experience....however,arguably the best way to improve the matchday experience by far would be the introducton of Safe standing , a subject raised , looked into and 'agreed in principle'by OUFC- under KT's tenure, which seems to have been ignored by the current Administration, which a shame as if it had been continued towards OUFC would have been trailblazing Safe Standing instead of as it is present...not involved whatsoever, even though the safe standing campaign has support from more and more football clubs. But NOT OUFC.... Granted the stadium is not owned by OUFC, nonetheless, a low roofed, 4th stand incorperating rail seating/ safe standing WOULD enhance the matchsday atmosphere 1000%, so would therefore be something that any supporters group/gang/crew/firm/organisation/gathering or Army looking to improve the atmosphere I would have thought be 100% behind? ......nowt on the subject from YA as yet though? Why not? IMO the 'matchday experience' is the worst Ive ever experienced this season......Im 'encouraged' to use a bar thats over priced with limited chioce, where Im NOT allowed to take by overpriced, insipid tasting 'beer' in its wobbly plastic receptacle outside with me to have a ciggy....when I return my overpriced 'beer' has been swiped, assumably by someone fed up with waiting to be served.... all so the club might , on a good matchday 'earn' a massive £20 or thereabouts as their share of the revenue split of bar profits..... I tried it, I dont like it in the 12th yellow supporters bar, I like to have a ciggy with a drink.... Im not a child, I can evidently look after the plastic receptacle with 'beer' in that Ive paid for, considerably better than the self important lanyard wearing suits on one door & the sia licenced 'security' on the main door to the aforementioned bar....as an aside any wonder some feel the need for a ciggy in the toilets inside the stadium?.... WHY am I not permitted to take my overpriced insipid tasting 'beer' in its floppy plastic receptacle outside the bar with me when I want a ciggy? That Im not allowed to smoke & drink at the 'same' time was the cherry on the top as far as the supporters bar goes..wont use it now! A PROPER OUFC supporters club would be ideal....the unofficial supporters club venue for many seasons was the conveniently located... now empty Priory! rip ....where you could smoke and look after/ drink your beer (from a wide range of choices), meet up with friends in the buildup to the match, without having to pay for the privelage of drinking there....IMO the club administration could have, maybe should have & perhaps still could rectify the situation by leasing the Priory ( on favourable terms of course) as OUFC supporters club..... after all Im eliably informed the OUFC current board members do have experience in 'running pubs' with interests in hostelries in Woodstock The pre match and half time 'music' is innapropriate for football IMO ( and invariably too loud for pre match & halftime entertainment).... does it need to be delivered at the volume it is at? its innapropriateness and volume supresses and suffocates any atmosphere that may be starting to build......who chooses the music thats imposed? is it really selected by a long term football fan ....or is the choice down to some college graduate who presumes ( like the Wembley stadium administration) that ALL atmosphere generated by ALL sport fans need to be drowned out by loud music ( as was attempted at the play off final !!!!) And whats with the damn patronising 'announcements' at half time " this is a family stadium , dont use bad language " its actually a more long winded statement/announcement that really winds me up every time I hear it.....words of Anglo Saxon origin have been in common usage by working people in this country for centuries...... being talked down to like that makes me want to shout f*ck OFF in the direction of the announcer ( I do just about manage to resist the temptation as Im in the family stand) So for the first season ever I chose to enter the breeze block stadium about 5 mins before kick off instead of 15 -20 mins before kick off....I choose to have a pre match beer while having a ciggy in the appropriate designated area & meeting up with people at The Blackbird..... theres actually something of a real pre match buzz there pre home games....unlike in the 'supporters bar' where Ive found the atmosphere pre match is as flat as the swill served up at the bars. Uniting all the(OUFC) fans is an admirable aim.... in reality, when the current OUFC Administration seem to be miles away from what Oxford United supporers WANT , Uniting all OUFC fans isnt achievable currently sadly IMO..... any wonder gates are still low? ....away days are so much more fun, like going to support your team should be!, maybe if some of the OUFC Administration went to a few away games with the fans as opposed to fellow employees MAYBE they might, just might have their blinkers removed on what it is fans actually want as the matchday experience, instead of trying to impose ideals that in the main simply and clearly dont work IF you can tell me, assure me, that absolutely and catagorically there has been NO interference, or attempt to lead YA into certain directions, or that YA people havent been asked to/ made to adhere to 'charterhouse rules' on sensitive subjects by anyone involved with or on behalf of OUFC Administration, then I'll take your word on it JL Good luck with YA ....Ive a feeling YA will need all the luck there is the way things stand Though I still feel the there should be ACCOUNTABILITY ....:-) So your saying club should continue with let's backing of safe standing, by introducing a fourth stand. Who do u propose pays for that stand. Kassam won't. Lenagan ain't going to fork out an extra couple of mil loss just so some fans can stand, and in doing so meaning the ox mail stand has a couple of hundred away fans in it and the north stand sits empty 22/23 games a season . Yes it may improve the atmosphere but realistically we ain't going to be looking at a fourth stand Until we own the ground or we r pushing championship with crowds over 8-9 k each week. Even the proposed planing for houses only included provision for a fourth stand not actually the building if it
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Post by essexyellows on Feb 26, 2014 8:41:03 GMT
The biggest problem is that football has changed a lot and many of us of a certain generation don`t like it.
We never needed a "YA/12th Man" because the atmosphere was spontaneous. We went to an affordable game, had a few drinks with friends in a pub (not some plastic pseudo bar)and enjoyed the time away from work, family etc.
The closure of the Priory was the last nail in the concrete coffin that is the Kas-stad, up until then it was just about tolerable having somewhere you could have a decent drink, catch up with friends etc.... that focus point is lost & the "Bar of the Mysterious Percentages" is NEVER going to cut it.
Having said that.... I`ll still renew the ST next season....might even use it and live in hope of better things....its what we do & always have done.
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Post by sarge on Feb 26, 2014 8:52:26 GMT
cheers for the lengthy reply JL Just a couple of follow up Qs re the bar share....who told you it was a good deal, and what did the mystery person/persons base their assesment on?...my natural cynisim would automatically kick in and ask the question based on what? Where and how does Charlie Methevan fit in with YA ? I dont have any problem with the aims of YA to improve the atmosphere & matchday experience.... however,arguably the best way to improve the matchday experience by far would be the introducton of Safe standing , a subject raised , looked into and 'agreed in principle'by OUFC- under KT's tenure, which seems to have been ignored by the current Administration, which a shame as if it had been continued towards OUFC would have been trailblazing Safe Standing instead of as it is present...not involved whatsoever, even though the safe standing campaign has support from more and more football clubs. But NOT OUFC.... Granted the stadium is not owned by OUFC, nonetheless, a low roofed, 4th stand incorperating rail seating/ safe standing WOULD enhance the matchsday atmosphere 1000%, so would therefore be something that any supporters group/gang/crew/firm/organisation/gathering or Army looking to improve the atmosphere I would have thought be 100% behind? ......nowt on the subject from YA as yet though? Why not?IMO the 'matchday experience' is the worst Ive ever experienced this season......Im 'encouraged' to use a bar thats over priced with limited chioce, where Im NOT allowed to take by overpriced, insipid tasting 'beer' in its wobbly plastic receptacle outside with me to have a ciggy....when I return my overpriced 'beer' has been swiped, assumably by someone fed up with waiting to be served.... all so the club might , on a good matchday 'earn' a massive £20 or thereabouts as their share of the revenue split of bar profits..... I tried it, I dont like it in the 12th yellow supporters bar, I like to have a ciggy with a drink.... Im not a child, I can evidently look after the plastic receptacle with 'beer' in that Ive paid for, considerably better than the self important lanyard wearing suits on one door & the sia licenced 'security' on the main door to the aforementioned bar....as an aside any wonder some feel the need for a ciggy in the toilets inside the stadium?.... WHY am I not permitted to take my overpriced insipid tasting 'beer' in its floppy plastic receptacle outside the bar with me when I want a ciggy? That Im not allowed to smoke & drink at the 'same' time was the cherry on the top as far as the supporters bar goes..wont use it now! A PROPER OUFC supporters club would be ideal....the unofficial supporters club venue for many seasons was the conveniently located... now empty Priory! rip ....where you could smoke and look after/ drink your beer (from a wide range of choices), meet up with friends in the buildup to the match, without having to pay for the privelage of drinking there....IMO the club administration could have, maybe should have & perhaps still could rectify the situation by leasing the Priory ( on favourable terms of course) as OUFC supporters club..... after all Im eliably informed the OUFC current board members do have experience in 'running pubs' with interests in hostelries in Woodstock The pre match and half time 'music' is innapropriate for football IMO ( and invariably too loud for pre match & halftime entertainment).... does it need to be delivered at the volume it is at? its innapropriateness and volume supresses and suffocates any atmosphere that may be starting to build......who chooses the music thats imposed? is it really selected by a long term football fan ....or is the choice down to some college graduate who presumes ( like the Wembley stadium administration) that ALL atmosphere generated by ALL sport fans need to be drowned out by loud music ( as was attempted at the play off final !!!!) And whats with the damn patronising 'announcements' at half time " this is a family stadium , dont use bad language " its actually a more long winded statement/announcement that really winds me up every time I hear it.....words of Anglo Saxon origin have been in common usage by working people in this country for centuries...... being talked down to like that makes me want to shout f*ck OFF in the direction of the announcer ( I do just about manage to resist the temptation as Im in the family stand) So for the first season ever I chose to enter the breeze block stadium about 5 mins before kick off instead of 15 -20 mins before kick off....I choose to have a pre match beer while having a ciggy in the appropriate designated area & meeting up with people at The Blackbird..... theres actually something of a real pre match buzz there pre home games....unlike in the 'supporters bar' where Ive found the atmosphere pre match is as flat as the swill served up at the bars. Uniting all the(OUFC) fans is an admirable aim.... in reality, when the current OUFC Administration seem to be miles away from what Oxford United supporers WANT , Uniting all OUFC fans isnt achievable currently sadly IMO..... any wonder gates are still low? ....away days are so much more fun, like going to support your team should be!, maybe if some of the OUFC Administration went to a few away games with the fans as opposed to fellow employees MAYBE they might, just might have their blinkers removed on what it is fans actually want as the matchday experience, instead of trying to impose ideals that in the main simply and clearly dont work IF you can tell me, assure me, that absolutely and catagorically there has been NO interference, or attempt to lead YA into certain directions, or that YA people havent been asked to/ made to adhere to 'charterhouse rules' on sensitive subjects by anyone involved with or on behalf of OUFC Administration, then I'll take your word on it JL Good luck with YA ....Ive a feeling YA will need all the luck there is the way things stand Though I still feel the there should be ACCOUNTABILITY ....:-) So your saying club should continue with let's backing of safe standing, by introducing a fourth stand. Who do u propose pays for that stand. Kassam won't. Lenagan ain't going to fork out an extra couple of mil loss just so some fans can stand, and in doing so meaning the ox mail stand has a couple of hundred away fans in it and the north stand sits empty 22/23 games a season . Yes it may improve the atmosphere but realistically we ain't going to be looking at a fourth stand Until we own the ground or we r pushing championship with crowds over 8-9 k each week. Even the proposed planing for houses only included provision for a fourth stand not actually the building if it Im Saying a lot of things .....INCLUDING that the current club Administration SHOULD stand by the (previous) AGREEMENT in principle ....as was given under KT's Tenure....to back safe standing....and as stated (AND HIGHLIGHTED SO YOU CAN EASILY REREAD IT), granted the stadium isnt owned by OUFC....but with London Welsh, hopefully, heading off to eggchase in Witney, the fast deteriorating breeze block may become avail' a a knock down price ( heres hoping) ....the point being made is that IF YELLOW ARMY are really aiming to improve the Atmosphere at home games, Safe Standing is, IMO something that YA should be aiming for,( to date NOTHING has been forthcoming from YELLOW ARMY on the subject of Safe Standing), so I was asking WHY NOT..... you seem a sensible chap( or chapess) so I wouldve thought youd understand that introducing Safe Standing via rail seating ( the German template) in a 4th stand would take time to plan and to have the infastructure in place and ready for once the stadium is under the ownership of OUFC...therefore a bit of forward planing,including pressing for an agreement with the current OUFC Administration -(& I reiterate,who have chosen to ignore the agreement in principle to support the introduction of safe standing under KTs tenure)-, to agree to introduce stafe standing, with improving the atmosphere at the top of their agenda, this should be an absolute MUST, a top priority, for Yellow army to achieve in their drive to improve atmosphere........ Maybe that EXPLAINS what Im saying on the subject of safe standing, amongst the OTHER things Im saying too!!! NOW, answers to the Qs Ive asked would be good too
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Post by sarge on Feb 26, 2014 9:07:56 GMT
The biggest problem is that football has changed a lot and many of us of a certain generation don`t like it. We never needed a "YA/12th Man" because the atmosphere was spontaneous. We went to an affordable game, had a few drinks with friends in a pub (not some plastic pseudo bar)and enjoyed the time away from work, family etc. The closure of the Priory was the last nail in the concrete coffin that is the Kas-stad, up until then it was just about tolerable having somewhere you could have a decent drink, catch up with friends etc.... that focus point is lost & the "Bar of the Mysterious Percentages" is NEVER going to cut it. Having said that.... I`ll still renew the ST next season....might even use it and live in hope of better things....its what we do & always have done. Spot on post Essexyellows .....wish I could make my points in such a short & to the point manner too
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Post by Gary Baldi on Feb 26, 2014 9:13:46 GMT
What are you prattling on about? JL has never mentioned that, not for the 12th Man. I don't know where people got this from. I've always been of the understanding that the fans did it for the fans to improve things. Some people decided to step up and do something. The club are supporting the effort, but not appointing people to it.
I can't help but see a few fans enjoying agitating things. I don't know why, but they seem to enjoy it.
Read it again SOMEONE mentioned earlier this statement was preceded by JL. Was that someone a YA stakeholder? Or just someone?
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Post by Gary Baldi on Feb 26, 2014 9:18:24 GMT
So your saying club should continue with let's backing of safe standing, by introducing a fourth stand. Who do u propose pays for that stand. Kassam won't. Lenagan ain't going to fork out an extra couple of mil loss just so some fans can stand, and in doing so meaning the ox mail stand has a couple of hundred away fans in it and the north stand sits empty 22/23 games a season . Yes it may improve the atmosphere but realistically we ain't going to be looking at a fourth stand Until we own the ground or we r pushing championship with crowds over 8-9 k each week. Even the proposed planing for houses only included provision for a fourth stand not actually the building if it Im Saying a lot of things .....INCLUDING that the current club Administration SHOULD stand by the (previous) AGREEMENT in principle ....as was given under KT's Tenure....to back safe standing....and as stated (AND HIGHLIGHTED SO YOU CAN EASILY REREAD IT), granted the stadium isnt owned by OUFC....but with London Welsh, hopefully, heading off to eggchase in Witney, the fast deteriorating breeze block may become avail' a a knock down price ( heres hoping) ....the point being made is that IF YELLOW ARMY are really aiming to improve the Atmosphere at home games, Safe Standing is, IMO something that YA should be aiming for,( to date NOTHING has been forthcoming from YELLOW ARMY on the subject of Safe Standing), so I was asking WHY NOT..... you seem a sensible chap( or chapess) so I wouldve thought youd understand that introducing Safe Standing via rail seating ( the German template) in a 4th stand would take time to plan and to have the infastructure in place and ready for once the stadium is under the ownership of OUFC...therefore a bit of forward planing,including pressing for an agreement with the current OUFC Administration -(& I reiterate,who have chosen to ignore the agreement in principle to support the introduction of safe standing under KTs tenure)-, to agree to introduce stafe standing, with improving the atmosphere at the top of their agenda, this should be an absolute MUST, a top priority, for Yellow army to achieve in their drive to improve atmosphere........ Maybe that EXPLAINS what Im saying on the subject of safe standing, amongst the OTHER things Im saying too!!! NOW, answers to the Qs Ive asked would be good too Safe Standing is not on the cards right now. The Football League are trying to do something about it, but with one major bottleneck that will never talk about it in any way, we can't do anything about it. It was all well and good KT saying we like/back Safe Standing, but it's not legal and we don't own the ground. Meaning until we own the ground, it's a statement that is as pointless as it gets. It's a nice soundbite though.
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Post by SteMerritt on Feb 26, 2014 9:20:14 GMT
I broadly agree with Sarge and EssexYellows.
What I would say though, the issue of Safe Standing, I don't think this is the Yellow Army's place to be pushing, but OxVox, this is where you should be making all the noises. Obviously there are major hurdles to clear, but this is what I would like my supporters' group talking about. Perhaps making the case to Stad Co about the benenfits for a dual-sport stadium to be flexible.
Another point Sarge makes is The Priory. It just cannot be underestimated how much this added to the matchday experience. Think back to the Swindon game for example, the place was packed solid and crackling with atmosphere. Yellow Army once again, not sure how much sway they would hold, but OxVox? Another thing I would hope you are talking to the relevant parties about.
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Post by SteMerritt on Feb 26, 2014 9:22:56 GMT
Safe Standing is not on the cards right now. The Football League are trying to do something about it, but with one major bottleneck that will never talk about it in any way, we can't do anything about it. It was all well and good KT saying we like/back Safe Standing, but it's not legal and we don't own the ground. Meaning until we own the ground, it's a statement that is as pointless as it gets. It's a nice soundbite though. No it's not on the cards right now, but noises should be constantly being made. Didn't Bristol City announce they were going to install some recently? If so, I'd love to see representatives from OUFC making a visit, looking about, getting in the press with their support. The only way things will change is if there is a visible support for it. I believe that there is a large number of OUFC supporters who would fill a terrace at the ground.
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Post by Gary Baldi on Feb 26, 2014 9:24:35 GMT
Safe Standing is such a great idea. But until the authorities get over the hump of Liverpool, I doubt it will gain any meaningful traction. And OxVox are very much the channel for this.
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Post by sihath on Feb 26, 2014 9:37:39 GMT
Safe standing is a great idea and will improve the atmosphere during the match. But we don't own the ground and until we do we have to work with what we've got.
How will the YA making statements about safe standing and pushing the club to make statements about safe standing change the atmosphere/experience NOW? It won't. What the YA are trying to do is make a difference now, and surely it makes sense to focus their energy on things they can change rather than effectively wasting resources on something that's totally beyond their control.
Don't want to get all religious but this came to mind:
God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, The courage to change the things I can, And wisdom to know the difference.
The YA are trying to change the things they can. I think that's wise.
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Post by sihath on Feb 26, 2014 10:08:17 GMT
OK. So what realistic, tangible things do fans want the YA to do.
Not things that OxVox already do, or are the 'appropriate' organisation to deal with, but things that fans think will improve the matchday atmosphere, that can be implemented quickly.
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