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Post by toucan on Sept 3, 2017 9:26:20 GMT
Dear ULTRAS - assuming you can read this - are you seeing the theme coming through on the forum? Real football fans are fed up with you? Please bring an atmosphere (excluding smoke bombs) but not to the detriment of supporters who want to watch a game of football. We are not interested in war!! Can you define a real football fan please. Thanks in advance.. One must assume he means ' Real fan ' to mean a fan that complies with the law in every respect when attending a football match and also shows due respect to those around him........
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Post by robie on Sept 3, 2017 9:35:22 GMT
Some of the reaction to the smoke bomb is over the top. But TVP used over excessive force to throw out one person which can only be for two reasons to show force or to try and entice further trouble. Considering we supposedly have a member of TVP on here trying to improve relations I have to question if they listen at all. By all means if you feel the need to eject the person do it in a reasonable manner but to use riot police and large numbers is not the correct approach. Intrigued to know what the ideal number of officers to arrest a person in a crowd is?
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Post by diagocostapacket on Sept 3, 2017 9:44:14 GMT
15 minutes of good football followed by 75 dull minutes. Our performances have been mediocre against mostly poor opposition which is why we have 8 points from 5 games. We will get found out if/when we come up against a good team. MK were another (Oldham, Cheltenham, Portsmouth, Stevenage) poor team and yet we somehow made them look better than us at times in the second half. I struggle to see how anyone can think the team is better than last season? Williamson is admittedly an asset to the team if he can stay fit, but the other non loanee signings are nowhere near as impressive. Ricardinho has his moments defensively but doesn't really offer much going forward. Henry rarely goes past a player and his shooting ability is shite. Tiendalli is injured after barely one game and yet nobody is allowed to mention the fact the guy is injury prone. People keep hiding behind the number of player changes we've had, citing the players need to gel and we'll reap the rewards. Shrewsbury changed 12 or so players last season and yet they were much the better team last week. Plus the player changes we've had to make are mostly self inflicted anyway as we simply can't hold on to anyone. We have very little in the way of an attacking force. Maybe this is the formation or perhaps it's that Obika isn't up to it or possibly a combination of the two. Pep clearly wants to focus on a mainly defensive formation and doesn't appear to have a desire to change this should it be required during a game e.g in the second half today. How many teams get every player back to defend corners and then don't have an outlet for the counter attack or just to relieve pressure? It's worrying Pep doesn't see we needed another striker given our limited options up front. We're now forced to work with what we've got up front for the next four months. This season has mid table written all over it. Each to his own my friend from Thomas Hardy Country...but I cant agree with most of that to be honest. I thought yesterdays game was very enjoyable and exciting and we played as well as most away teams do. I don't think we will struggle for goals when Obika and Van get into the groove and I think Hall could easily be a 15 goal a season man too. You worry to much..
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Post by grenobleroad on Sept 3, 2017 9:49:46 GMT
Correct me if i am wrong but wasn't the disabled viewing area at the back of the stand between the concourse and the seats yesterday?
I don't really have a problem with standing, if someone was stood in front of me yesterday there were plenty of available seats to move. Appreciate it's not always the case i.e Northampton.
However it's pretty common for a large section of our away following to stand. Yesterday was unusual as it was a local game so we had more people then usual who don't go too many away games.
What's the difference with this and Swindon away last year? Everyone stood and those who never just sat somewhere else.
It might not be fair but it's just the way it goes and always has been.
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Post by oufcyellows on Sept 3, 2017 9:53:09 GMT
Correct me if i am wrong but wasn't the disabled viewing area at the back of the stand between the concourse and the seats yesterday? I don't really have a problem with standing, if someone was stood in front of me yesterday there were plenty of available seats to move. Appreciate it's not always the case i.e Northampton. However it's pretty common for a large section of our away following to stand. Yesterday was unusual as it was a local game so we had more people then usual who don't go too many away games. What's the difference with this and Swindon away last year? Everyone stood and those who never just sat somewhere else. It might not be fair but it's just the way it goes and always has been. The difference is those who want to stay sitting at Swindon can choose to book their seat in a different stand
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Post by Barts on Sept 3, 2017 9:54:09 GMT
Some pretty dim-witted stewarding contributed to the Ultra issues, which I witnessed from close quarters. ย We were told very firmly to sit in our ticketed seats, so instead of the usual away match process of finding somewhere congenial, people were lumped together at random. ย When this caused friction, the stewards adopted a very officious approach. ย Instead of offering to find the unhappy fans better seats (and there were several thousand available), the stewards tried to move the Ultras, demanding to see the their tickets and trying to drag them out when these were not forthcoming. ย A little diplomacy and common sense would have gone a long way. Instead, there was an unseemly tug of war. ย It was in the midst of this that the smoke bomb was dropped. ย We all know that these are not allowed but I was about 3 foot from it and it seemed pretty harmless and unthreatening to me. When we scored, the Ultras celebrated vigorously, accidentally knocking a nearby elderly lady with limited mobility on the head. ย The lady was understandably frightened and I am sure it will have ruined her afternoon. ย It happened in the heat of the moment but an apology would have been appropriate. ย Some of the Ultras then realised they were causing distress and started an unofficial seat-swapping exercise which enabled the frailer supporters to move away, at which point the stewards belatedly joined in. ย I am not an 80s hooligan but I do enjoy the contribution that the Ultras make to the atmosphere at matches, and I really think the stewards could have avoided much of this trouble. So let me get this straight, the ultras knock an elderly lady on the head, don't apologise and then organise a ticket swap so that OTHERS can move away.... Unbelievable!!
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Post by headingtonutd on Sept 3, 2017 9:54:46 GMT
Heard some odious barracking of Obika when he screwed up that chance. We have our share of morons. There was also a bit of random standing up by fans in our area which was blocking pitch views. But it all got resolved in a fairly gentlemanly way., The stewards seemed to be enforcing seating aisle policy rigorously. So I guess there were some elderly supporters 'sat' in with the ultras. This lack of flexibility on seating arrangements doesn't help. You must have been sitting near us. A constant stream of nonsense coming out of them followed by a full on 'Swindon reject, lazy bastard, get him off' tirade. Showed a fantastic lack of knowledge or appreciation for the game which I found a little depressing honestly. Obika put a real shift in and barring a bad decision not to square straight away, he had a great game. I think there is plenty more to come from him. As for the Ultras and the seating I think everybody needs to take a deep breath. I like the colour and atmosphere they bring and have no problem with them standing. All it needs is a little flexibility and appreciation of those around them. Personally we sat where we wanted and didn't even check seat numbers. We were away from the Ultras and stood and sat as we pleased although I did check behind me to see if I was interfering with anyone else's game. The Ultras were stood on mass and if it had been me and I wanted a more relaxed view i'd have just moved to the other side where we were but then maybe they could have filled in that section from the top so as not to have anyone behind them? Either way we are all supporters and should be able to sit together on a gloriously sunny day and enjoy what was at times some fantastic flowing football without abusing each other. I have to say it's as boring hearing people brand them all louts for the way they support their club as it is hearing people call anyone who has the nerve to want to sit down, or heaven forbid even sit in the SSU, a prawn sandwich eating part timer who doesn't deserve to be called a supporter. There were an unusually high number of abusive U's fans there, one in particular picking on a female steward for seemingly no reason at all, but I guess our closest away game on a sunny day you are going to get a bit of that. Personally (and whisper it quietly) I think that is a fantastic ground wasted on lifeless supporters. Enjoyed the pre match Peroni beers opposite the ground in the sun and thought it was a pretty good day out all in all.
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Post by diagocostapacket on Sept 3, 2017 9:59:27 GMT
Children the lot of them... All clubs have them,... they are not really interested in OUFC or football ....its a testosterone fuelled territorial gathering sort of thing, a chance to congregate with similar of the species and do a bit of bleating...not unlike sheep, but sheep are generally more intelligent and smell better. The club can do without them to be honest, they do its reputation no good at all.
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Post by littlemore on Sept 3, 2017 10:02:44 GMT
Some of the reaction to the smoke bomb is over the top. But TVP used over excessive force to throw out one person which can only be for two reasons to show force or to try and entice further trouble. Considering we supposedly have a member of TVP on here trying to improve relations I have to question if they listen at all. By all means if you feel the need to eject the person do it in a reasonable manner but to use riot police and large numbers is not the correct approach. Intrigued to know what the ideal number of officers to arrest a person in a crowd is? That's a separate incident in relation to the first person getting taken out.
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Post by robie on Sept 3, 2017 10:09:02 GMT
I am aware of that, in your experience what is the ideal number of officers to arrest a person in a crowd?
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Post by littlemore on Sept 3, 2017 10:15:12 GMT
I am aware of that, in your experience what is the ideal number of officers to arrest a person in a crowd? I wouldn't make the arrest during the game but I'm not a police officer. With this database they have it wouldn't be hard to track the person down after the game which they've done in the past and this would lead to better atmosphere between fans and TVP rather then the big show of force. Personal opinion just thought it was over the top for a smoke bomb.
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Post by diagocostapacket on Sept 3, 2017 10:16:09 GMT
They let off 1 smokebomb, and now some of you are up in arms about it.If you don't like smokebombs then i suggest never watching football in eastern europe as you'll be in for a surprise. Why would we possibly want to watch Football in Eastern Europe... ??
Smoke bombs are for the battle field not a domestic football match.
What possible justification is there for a brainless moron letting one off ..??
If someone can give me a sensible answer I would be grateful.
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Post by oufcyellows on Sept 3, 2017 10:23:08 GMT
I don't get the argument that they should be allowed as they are abroad.They ain't that's all there is too it. It's like saying can't see why u can't have a few pints and drive, it's never hurt anyone, or I've texted while driving and it's always been fine, don't see the problem with it. It only takes one to be let off near someone with breathing difficulties and for it to lead to something far more serious. Might be a very small chance but not impossible. Not to mention the club have now asked several times and then pretty much begged that they stop being used at our matches
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Post by eighteen93 on Sept 3, 2017 10:24:16 GMT
Heard some odious barracking of Obika when he screwed up that chance. We have our share of morons. Disappointing to read that. He was great I thought and he must have felt confident to take that chance on. It was on his favored left foot and he should have maybe slipped in van Kessel. On a positive note I can see Obika, Hall, van Kessel, Payne and Mowatt being exciting to watch. Can't believe there are too many better options attacking wise in this league. COYY
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Post by grenobleroad on Sept 3, 2017 10:32:00 GMT
Correct me if i am wrong but wasn't the disabled viewing area at the back of the stand between the concourse and the seats yesterday? I don't really have a problem with standing, if someone was stood in front of me yesterday there were plenty of available seats to move. Appreciate it's not always the case i.e Northampton. However it's pretty common for a large section of our away following to stand. Yesterday was unusual as it was a local game so we had more people then usual who don't go too many away games. What's the difference with this and Swindon away last year? Everyone stood and those who never just sat somewhere else. It might not be fair but it's just the way it goes and always has been. The difference is those who want to stay sitting at Swindon can choose to book their seat in a different stand And the ones who had to get a ticket behind the goal?
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Post by oufcyellows on Sept 3, 2017 10:36:02 GMT
The difference is those who want to stay sitting at Swindon can choose to book their seat in a different stand And the ones who had to get a ticket behind the goal? Are then far fewer in number.and correct me if I'm wrong as I didn't go last season, but I've never been made to sit in the correct seat on the Stratton bank so people can move about. Again it's each to their own. Sitting doesn't make u some sort of lesser fan that should have to move elsewhere to accommodate those who do. But equally if u find ur self bang in the middle of a group of standing fans surely it's easier to move to somewhere ur going to enjoy the game, rather than just have a massive argument
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Post by diagocostapacket on Sept 3, 2017 10:36:06 GMT
Heard some odious barracking of Obika when he screwed up that chance. We have our share of morons. Disappointing to read that. He was great I thought and he must have felt confident to take that chance on. It was on his favored left foot and he should have maybe slipped in van Kessel. On a positive note I can see Obika, Hall, van Kessel, Payne and Mowatt being exciting to watch. Can't believe there are too many better options attacking wise in this league. COYY If I could give you more thumbs up then I would.
I agree and would include Henry, Ribeiro and Ronni in that number too...
I like your positivity though I dare say there will be a pessimist or two along shortly.
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Post by robie on Sept 3, 2017 10:44:51 GMT
I am aware of that, in your experience what is the ideal number of officers to arrest a person in a crowd? I wouldn't make the arrest during the game but I'm not a police officer. With this database they have it wouldn't be hard to track the person down after the game which they've done in the past and this would lead to better atmosphere between fans and TVP rather then the big show of force. Personal opinion just thought it was over the top for a smoke bomb. So the person pulls out a second smoke bomb as we score again, a fan nearby suffers an asthma attack and dies as a result. The police will be to blame for this as they had a chance to prevent that. You will probably find the police are quite busy before the match and after the match with less to do whilst the majority of fans watch the game. If fans see people getting away with such a blatant criminal offence they will be more inclined to do the same; a perceived accepted practice. Not everyone will find out three days later Joe Bloggs received a knock on the door at 4 am and is now on a banning order. It may well be perceived a show of force but if an officer can't do their job safely without 15+ so called fans surrounding them then one must ask what the alternatives are.
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Post by carefreeoufc on Sept 3, 2017 10:47:35 GMT
Go to IPlayer and watch some of the Glastonbury highlights. Pyro is leg off and no one is arrested. Go to a political rally at Westminster or Google it and there is Pyro let off. No one is hurt or arrested. It's a tool like the mobile phone app to ban or marginalise supporters. Pyro in a football ground isn't dangerous, those that pretend to keep order are Your opinion isn't relevant sonny, they are illegal and that's the end of it. i go to very few away games but when I have been the ultras were a bunch of kids, they were very excited but seemed harmless in general. Thanks Grandad
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Post by uptheus on Sept 3, 2017 10:53:22 GMT
I wouldn't make the arrest during the game but I'm not a police officer. With this database they have it wouldn't be hard to track the person down after the game which they've done in the past and this would lead to better atmosphere between fans and TVP rather then the big show of force. Personal opinion just thought it was over the top for a smoke bomb. So the person pulls out a second smoke bomb as we score again, a fan nearby suffers an asthma attack and dies as a result. The police will be to blame for this as they had a chance to prevent that. You will probably find the police are quite busy before the match and after the match with less to do whilst the majority of fans watch the game. If fans see people getting away with such a blatant criminal offence they will be more inclined to do the same; a perceived accepted practice. Not everyone will find out three days later Joe Bloggs received a knock on the door at 4 am and is now on a banning order. It may well be perceived a show of force but if an officer can't do their job safely without 15+ so called fans surrounding them then one must ask what the alternatives are. I think it might have been that the stewards seemed to have got the wrong person who let off the smoke bomb that incensed others which was probably unnecessary. It wasn't a police officer that was trying to evict the fan, but a steward who seemed hell bent on acting OTT who was then joined by a few more, and from what I saw I didn't see the fan or any fan for that matter actually hitting a steward. All they seemed to be doing was trying to stop a possible innocent person being evicted/arrested. I guess I'd be pretty p*ssed off if I was evicted/arrested for something that I didn't do.
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Post by eighteen93 on Sept 3, 2017 10:55:45 GMT
I'll always remember the smoke bomb that went off in that away stand (with the low roof) at Histon on that hot summer's day in 2009.
I get mild asthma and was very ill for half an hour as were many around me.
The smell and the fumes were putrid.
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Post by robie on Sept 3, 2017 10:58:23 GMT
I now have an image of 15+ people all declaring "I'm Brian"
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Post by holdsteady on Sept 3, 2017 10:59:14 GMT
Didn't go yesterday but I am looking forward to going to Blackpool even more now, even if the games shit I can at least watch all the arguments amongst our fan base.
Most of this could be solved if football in this country allowed people who wish to stand to actually do that in a suitable area, as other sports and entertainment events do, rather than penalise people for proven murderously inept policing nearly 30 years ago.
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Post by foley on Sept 3, 2017 11:06:30 GMT
Because they are just the perfect club for you... Goodness knows, you will thorougly enjoy the silence and they really f*cking need you. fan to the other. And a bit of common sense and thought from both side s is all that's needed. Manorlounger was made to sit in his seat by the stewards, junior says his ticket was thrown away and told to sit where they like, so picking the back of the stand is probably a better option than the front, as u won't force all those behind to stand as well. Also the end blocks are normally the emptiest, and last to fill so would probably make sense that fans wanting to stand could gather there and not have people telling them to sit down or get out their seat, rather than forcing into the middle where people have already taken their seats. Like I said bit of common sense from both sides, acceptance from the ultras that not everyone wants to stand and sing and is an idiot for not wanting to, and from others that everyone was young once and doing the same things on the London Rd, and that without them supporting oufc would be a lot less colourful and quiet. Spot on. It needed a little common sense. There was loads of room (lots of free seats near where I sat (4 or 5 seats in a row) The stewards could simply have suggested that people who were inconvenienced moved- they had plenty of choice. Having said that the setting off of a flare was pretty brainless. I don't know how dangerous these flares are, but in the current climate the setting off of flares is seen to be dangerous and anybody setting them off are asking for trouble.
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Post by oufcyellows on Sept 3, 2017 11:11:30 GMT
fan to the other. And a bit of common sense and thought from both side s is all that's needed. Manorlounger was made to sit in his seat by the stewards, junior says his ticket was thrown away and told to sit where they like, so picking the back of the stand is probably a better option than the front, as u won't force all those behind to stand as well. Also the end blocks are normally the emptiest, and last to fill so would probably make sense that fans wanting to stand could gather there and not have people telling them to sit down or get out their seat, rather than forcing into the middle where people have already taken their seats. Like I said bit of common sense from both sides, acceptance from the ultras that not everyone wants to stand and sing and is an idiot for not wanting to, and from others that everyone was young once and doing the same things on the London Rd, and that without them supporting oufc would be a lot less colourful and quiet. Spot on. It needed a little common sense. There was loads of room (lots of free seats near where I sat (4 or 5 seats in a row) The stewards could simply have suggested that people who were inconvenienced moved- they had plenty of choice. Having said that the setting off of a flare was pretty brainless. I don't know how dangerous these flares are, but in the current climate the setting off of flares is seen to be dangerous and anybody setting them off are asking for trouble. Thing is they don't have to be pretty dangerous. They can be nearly harmless to the majority. A peanut is not dangerous, but a restaurant has to make sure it informs everyone of its presence as to one person it's deadly. Same with smoke bombs, the person letting it off has no idea of the health of hundreds of people around them. Like I said it only takes 1 person to have health issues and suddenly it's far from harmless. Not to mention illegal, and the club asking for them not to be used.
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Post by oldman159 on Sept 3, 2017 11:17:08 GMT
to me there is a simple answer to the "I insist I must sit in the random seat I have allocated by a computer" question.
Make All "away" seats at ALL games sold on a 'non allocated' basis. Then...(if you want to be a standing ultra or whatever) Get there early enough to stake your claim. It was interested that when we entered by aisle 30 yesterday we were told by the lady steward we could sit anywhere in the block to our left ( our randomly allocated seats were near the front.) so we chose the back row. However.... The Stewards on aisle 31 had embarked on their own strict enforcement plot. There seemed no reason for the differences, it was just 'policy'! If you are going to have policy..better make sure its a good ONE ...
Having said that, though, seems that no matter where I chose to sit there will always be 3 or 4 who will stand in front of me! Some away games I have moved 2 or 3 times. Doh!
As for the Odious barracking, sadly Martin and Obika were subjected to a continuously foul mouthed and cretinous tirade from one Charmer near us.... football "fans" don't you just love em?
COYYs!
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Post by ryaniobirdio on Sept 3, 2017 11:27:43 GMT
I'll always remember the smoke bomb that went off in that away stand (with the low roof) at Histon on that hot summer's day in 2009. I get mild asthma and was very ill for half an hour as were many around me. The smell and the fumes were putrid. Sorry, you're not allowed to bring up that sort of stuff. You can't bring up that people have illnesses, allergies, conditions etc that might be badly affected by a smoke bomb, which is an illegal object in the first place. You can't mention that some people have terrible asthma, are perhaps recovering from lung cancer (both things that my immediate family can account for statistically) and so forth. You can't mention those things, because it's a non-issue and the REAL solution is for those people to not go to football. If you're suffering from illness? Don't go to football. If you have a respiratory condition of any kind? Don't go to football. Basically, just don't go to football unless you're young, fit, healthy, and up for a bit of a ruckus. Have I got it right?
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Post by yellowoptimist on Sept 3, 2017 12:26:27 GMT
Heard some odious barracking of Obika when he screwed up that chance. We have our share of morons. There was also a bit of random standing up by fans in our area which was blocking pitch views. But it all got resolved in a fairly gentlemanly way., The stewards seemed to be enforcing seating aisle policy rigorously. So I guess there were some elderly supporters 'sat' in with the ultras. This lack of flexibility on seating arrangements doesn't help. Yep me too. Stuff like put your f..Ing red shirt on etc. Complete morons!
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Post by rickyotto on Sept 3, 2017 12:33:16 GMT
They let off 1 smokebomb, and now some of you are up in arms about it.If you don't like smokebombs then i suggest never watching football in eastern europe as you'll be in for a surprise. Why would we possibly want to watch Football in Eastern Europe... ??
Smoke bombs are for the battle field not a domestic football match.
What possible justification is there for a brainless moron letting one off ..??
If someone can give me a sensible answer I would be grateful.
1. We've finally made the champions league and Cannice Carrol has captained us to the group stages 2. I reckon if we've been using yellow smoke bombs on the battle field that may be how Islamic State lasted so long๐ 3. I can't speak for brainless morons, and I've never let one off myself, but my recollection generally is that when they have been let off the singing and atmosphere seems to raise up a few notches regardless of whether it's right or wrong . I can see both sides of this debate to be honest
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Post by oufcyellows on Sept 3, 2017 12:36:17 GMT
Why would we possibly want to watch Football in Eastern Europe... ??
Smoke bombs are for the battle field not a domestic football match.
What possible justification is there for a brainless moron letting one off ..??
If someone can give me a sensible answer I would be grateful.
1. We've finally made the champions league and Cannice Carrol has captained us to the group stages 2. I reckon if we've been using yellow smoke bombs on the battle field that may be how Islamic State lasted so long๐ 3. I can't speak for brainless morons, and I've never let one off myself, but my recollection generally is that when they have been let off the singing and atmosphere seems to raise up a few notches regardless of whether it's right or wrong . I can see both sides of this debate to be honest I don't think there is two sides of the debate while they are illegal. No different to drink driving.
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