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Post by ZeroTheHero on Apr 16, 2014 22:11:17 GMT
I agree that it's a disgrace what's happening to the Priory. But I really can't see it opening as a pub again anytime soon. OGB will maybe have to secure the building and make some repairs - but surely there's no way of forcing him to run a loss-making boozer, much as we might all want it back? And he isn't going to do it out of the kindness of his heart! Loss making!! I thought there was a roaring trade in food, tins and cider? Well yes. 23 days per year, plus a few extra for the rugby and a few more for cup ties etc. Lets be generous and say 40 days a year. Even on those days, it's not all day - people leave to go to a match. And what about the other 320-odd? The OGB leased the pub to CottonSocks, he couldn't make a go of it. If it were really profitable don't you think OGB would have it open in a shot? Or another landlord wanting to take it over? Besides, he's got people drinking in the stadium now - hardly any extra expense (certainly non when there isn't a match) and certainly easier than trying to keep a pub going. My doubts over whether it will (ever?) reopen as a pub don't mean that I think fighting for the future of the building is anything but an excellent idea. And yes, making the building secure and maintained is at least the first step along the road of reopening it as a pub - I feel that it might be a long road though.
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Post by londonroader on Apr 17, 2014 6:29:13 GMT
Loss making!! I thought there was a roaring trade in food, tins and cider? Well yes. 23 days per year, plus a few extra for the rugby and a few more for cup ties etc. Lets be generous and say 40 days a year. Even on those days, it's not all day - people leave to go to a match. And what about the other 320-odd? The OGB leased the pub to CottonSocks, he couldn't make a go of it. If it were really profitable don't you think OGB would have it open in a shot? Or another landlord wanting to take it over? Besides, he's got people drinking in the stadium now - hardly any extra expense (certainly non when there isn't a match) and certainly easier than trying to keep a pub going. My doubts over whether it will (ever?) reopen as a pub don't mean that I think fighting for the future of the building is anything but an excellent idea. And yes, making the building secure and maintained is at least the first step along the road of reopening it as a pub - I feel that it might be a long road though. I will not take this thread off track, you are right, without seeing the accounts we have to believe it was unprofitable through the books.
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Post by mcf86 on Apr 17, 2014 7:37:59 GMT
Tim was being charged £1,000 a week! Anyone who knows about pub rents is aware a pub with the Priory's location, size, facilities and condition would never have a £1,000 a week price tag on it. Kassam will not be paying anything like that amount to OCC for the lease. The pub definitely has potential to operate profitably and when Tim walked, he and many others thought Kassam would install a manager but I think we are all too well aware Kassam has other/bigger plans for the site. We all should be challenging OCC on this matter. Sent from my GT-I9505 using proboards Can't agree more, so anyone who has not done so- please, fire off an email to OCC or there are online forms on their Official site to fill in.
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Post by sarge on Apr 17, 2014 7:47:35 GMT
Well yes. 23 days per year, plus a few extra for the rugby and a few more for cup ties etc. Lets be generous and say 40 days a year. Even on those days, it's not all day - people leave to go to a match. And what about the other 320-odd? The OGB leased the pub to CottonSocks, he couldn't make a go of it. If it were really profitable don't you think OGB would have it open in a shot? Or another landlord wanting to take it over? Besides, he's got people drinking in the stadium now - hardly any extra expense (certainly non when there isn't a match) and certainly easier than trying to keep a pub going. My doubts over whether it will (ever?) reopen as a pub don't mean that I think fighting for the future of the building is anything but an excellent idea. And yes, making the building secure and maintained is at least the first step along the road of reopening it as a pub - I feel that it might be a long road though. I will not take this thread off track, you are right, without seeing the accounts we have to believe it was unprofitable through the books. OGB isnt called OGB for no reason...... fine? and/or at least being forced to pay for repairs & upkeep of the Grade 2 listed building he is leasing from OCC ( OOH I hope so)..... BTW does anyone know what 'the men in hard hats' were doing there yesterday?..... wasnt the rent he was charging for The Priory hugely OTT in relation the the actualities and viabilities of The Priory? I have a suspicion, that after boarding the building up last summer, OGB was hoping that it would fall into such a bad state of repair that it would need to be demolished on safety grounds.... literally paving the way for him to build a new hotel.( Predominantly on the site of Minchery farm country club...which itself was demolished after a 'mystery' fire not long after OGB became leaseholder of both the country club AND The Priory!!! ....hmmmm!) If, as appears to be happenning, English Heritage, Oxfordshire Preservation trust, and at the the owner OCC ( among other organisations) are now keeping a close(r) eye so to speak, on The Priory, maybe, just maybe instead of shelling out on ( useless) security to patrol the site when empty, OGB may take the decision that some income is better than no income regarding The Priory? Perhaps, if OxVOx & Yellow Army (as they are the only supporters representatives that the current OUFC Admin will discuss ANYTHING with ) insisted that they, OUFC Administration, started listening to what the supporters want from the matchday experience ( instead of agreeing to idiotic schemes such as the 'mystery percentage bar'...) and The Priory becomes matchday supporters club? ( perhaps in conjunction with LW? as their matchday supporters club?) ..... it would then at least be in part time use .....fact is its highly unlikely to be a profitable concern on most days of the week as a pub, given its location and all the Ka$$am leased food n drink outlets better located in the Bowlplex complex... ... maybe OUFC Admin could rent The Priory for additional office space (upstairs), so it is in use,albeit not always as a supporters club ? There must be countless usages for the building that could be considered? ....besides OUFC Board Members have experience in running hostelries.... with one or two in Woodstock that are or have been under their wing! Bottom line is we want our matchday pub back :-)
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Post by sarge on Apr 17, 2014 8:00:45 GMT
Interestingly the back page of todays Oxford Mail ( no link as its not online yet) The Headline reads OVER TO YOU , the sub headline reads HOPE: U's Chief Says Financial Success Hinges On Fans' Support ....which brings both OxVox and Yellow Army into play ...doesnt it? ........with The Priory operating on matchdays, a watering hole where many , many OUFC supports felt comfortable to meet & drink pre ( & post) Match, maybe the extra 1000 fans through the turnstiles ( perhaps even more over time) would 'return' ..... something for our supporters group(s) to put forward to the Lenagans on our behalf methinks ? EDIT - link for todays OM - www.oxfordmail.co.uk/sport/oxfordunited/11153879.Oxford_United_owner_says_fans_hold_the_key_to_financial_stability/
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Post by Maurice Earp on Apr 17, 2014 10:37:52 GMT
OxVox are preparing a survey about The Priory and will be speaking to Firoka about its findings.
Questions on the survey might contain a simple yes/no vote along with other Priory/match day atmosphere based questions that could help decide if getting The Priory back up and running is something that people want to happen and would be willing to contribute to. The opening of The Priory on matchdays only and being run by like minded supporters, what the fans want in terms of Drinks ie Real Ales, Real Ciders, etc. Please list what you would like included in the survey if this idea/wish/plan were to come into being.
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Post by scotters on Apr 17, 2014 10:50:31 GMT
I'd like to know if there are any alternatives to opening the pub full-time?
While I'm impressed and grateful at the effort fans are putting into the issue, got to say I find it very hard to imagine the Priory ever working again as a proper pub.
is there any possibility of running some kind of pop-up bar on matchdays on the grounds there in exchange for a small rent? Or in exchange for a contract to maintain and preserve the building and grounds? I know there were planning problems with putting up the marquee there in the past, is there any chance of changing that?
I know there is very little incentive for Kassam to do anything about the Priory but there doesn't seem to be much that anyone could do with it on a commercial basis, and surely he'd prefer a small amount of income from a low-impact business than just getting nothing from it?
Just an idea.
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Post by Maurice Earp on Apr 17, 2014 11:04:49 GMT
^^ Keep the ideas coming ^^
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Post by Matt D on Apr 17, 2014 12:19:18 GMT
Baz, we are the voice of Oxford United; us supporters. OxVox represents us in certain ways - like with the club. This is a situation where the volume of complaints may be changing the attitude of the Council. It's good if Oxvox helps but it's not just their fight - it's ours. The more complaints there are about the Priory, and it's owners shamefully letting it fall to bits, the better. Getcha game face on feller. We're starting to make a difference. agree with you entirely. oxvox is just a way of helping supporters organise, on the principle that a united voice is a stronger voice. but individual supporters (whether they choose to join oxvox or not) of course make a difference, and it's great to see everyone getting involved on this thread. oxvox will look at what the feasability of action is here, and what the implications of some of the heritage issues are. while oxvox may be able to exercise a bit of influence as a 'formal organisation', nonetheless members of oxvox and its committee are just individual supporters, and the more people involved, the more likely we are to accomplish what we want.
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Post by sarge on Apr 17, 2014 12:22:49 GMT
Office space upstairs 5-7 days a week? ....meeting room ( OxVox, Yellow Army etc also for localish organisations/ clubs/societies- inc fundraising /charity nites etc) downstairs.... supporters club matchdays ( inc awaydays....meeting point pre travelling by coach, with bacon butties/tea/coffee etc on offer.....post journey pint after travelling back?...... applicable to OUFC... AND LW IF they are as they claim to be committed to Oxford, havent THEY considered running coaches FROM Oxford to away games? The Priory if functioning, would be an ideal meeting point Id say! )
there are many more ways The Priory could be put into good use in addition to being the official Matchday supporters club
lets face it the farcical 'mystery percentage bar' , which appears to be what OUFC Administration perceive as a suitable replacement to The Priory, is actually far from suitable- limited choice on offer, too expensive, too hot in there, very limited capacity, minimal amount of seats, smokers have to leave their drink behind when going outside to smoke ( often to find it has been stolen on return), imposed admission fee every game ( unless you hold a season ticket), hearing what the various legends have to say isnt easy, ridiculously long queues at the bars, the percentage of profit going to OUFC is still a mystery to all but the hand picked few, ( to paraphrase George Orwell, who must be more equal supporters than most of us!!!)...the list is endless as to why the 'replacement' for the Priory REALLY isnt a suitable replacement, nor ever will be.
IF the Matchday experience is something Yellow Army, OxVox and OUFC Admin' genuinely want to improve.....STOP imposing what the majority of supporters DONT want, start listening and acting upon what the majority of supporters DO want..... facts are, since the start of this season, with NO option of The Priory as a meeting point pre and post match attendances havent been good. No its not ALL down to The Priory being closed, however The Priory being closed down IS a contributory factor for sure!
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Post by sarge on Apr 17, 2014 13:02:16 GMT
...... how about the CLUB SHOP outlet?..... thats a 6-7 day a week option for the Priory.... seeing as weve been informed that the 'franchise' is coming back 'in house' as from the end of this season ..... there are so many options.....anyone with a bit of sense and no hidden agenda could compile a viable and workable long list of options
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Post by sarge on Apr 17, 2014 13:18:02 GMT
OxVox are preparing a survey about The Priory and will be speaking to Firoka about its findings. Questions on the survey might contain a simple yes/no vote along with other Priory/match day atmosphere based questions that could help decide if getting The Priory back up and running is something that people want to happen and would be willing to contribute to. The opening of The Priory on matchdays only and being run by like minded supporters, what the fans want in terms of Drinks ie Real Ales, Real Ciders, etc. Please list what you would like included in the survey if this idea/wish/plan were to come into being. good move Maurice ....who will be surveyed on the subject?.....hopefully it will be as many OUFC supporters as possible, via the survey being distributed on here, via email and hard copy on matchdays?.... ( only two left....well maybe 3 then ...plus Wembley....this season :-) )..... maybe by OxVox getting behind attempting to get The Priory back as a Public house ( even only on matchdays), it could see an upsurge in membership on the back of it? Maybe it could be the OxVox matchday 'office' :-) ? As an aside..... what were those observed 'men in hard hats' actually doing yesterday at The Priory?....does anyone know?
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Post by Paul Cannell on Apr 17, 2014 13:33:16 GMT
Yay. Best post ever! IF the Matchday experience is something Yellow Army, OxVox and OUFC Admin' genuinely want to improve.....STOP imposing what the majority of supporters DONT want, start listening and acting upon what the majority of supporters DO want..... I feel just as strongly as sarge, for the same reasons, however I'm not convinced that he and I are representative. If there's one thing a Matchday Experience survey must address it's the relevance of a 'pub-like' experience similar to what the old Priory provided. I wouldn't trust OxVox members alone to respond accurately across the demographic that used the Priory, though. Somehow it has to address the supporters who are coming less, or have stopped coming altogether over the last season and 9/10ths.
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Post by Robin Shater on Apr 17, 2014 15:24:18 GMT
There was a digger in the car park area as I drove past this afternoon, so maybe things are starting to be done.
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Post by sarge on Apr 17, 2014 16:36:55 GMT
...cheers Robin
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Post by brokeandobscure on Apr 17, 2014 17:00:07 GMT
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Post by brokeandobscure on Apr 17, 2014 17:02:45 GMT
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Post by brokeandobscure on Apr 17, 2014 19:01:47 GMT
Condition 5 on the "grant of planning permission" document is particularly relevant. Sorry, can't work out how to cut and paste it. Hopefully a hotel next door could make The Priory a viable pub outside of match days as well?
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Post by oxymoron on Apr 17, 2014 19:17:51 GMT
That application will have lapsed - they are only valid for five years
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Post by yellowshert on Apr 17, 2014 20:09:04 GMT
Why is IL going to spend more money on property to increases his losses even more. Everyone here accepts it is not a profitable going concern. There is not enough floor space to run a pub/shop either. The club shop maybe going in house but is there a long term lease on the shop.
Why should the yellow army or Oxvox be responsible for running a commercial food/drink establishment?
The best hope is FK to give up the lease and OCC to give a brewery some leeway regarding a marquee and a sensible rent to incentivise them.
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Post by bazzer9461 on Apr 17, 2014 20:16:58 GMT
That I thought was down to Oxvox the voice of Oxford utd. Are you a member of OxVox? Just askin. I'm not Maurice have thought about it but have a couple of issues, I'm not having a pop
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Post by Kerry Yellow on Apr 17, 2014 20:23:25 GMT
Some interesting points in the documents, one refering to a "recent fire" wonder who was responsible for that?
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Post by Paul Cannell on Apr 18, 2014 8:54:58 GMT
Why is IL going to spend more money on property to increases his losses even more. Everyone here accepts it is not a profitable going concern. There is not enough floor space to run a pub/shop either. The club shop maybe going in house but is there a long term lease on the shop. Why should the yellow army or Oxvox be responsible for running a commercial food/drink establishment? The best hope is FK to give up the lease and OCC to give a brewery some leeway regarding a marquee and a sensible rent to incentivise them. "Everyone accepts" isn't often very useful as a statement but it's pretty obvious that at a grand a week rent makes sure it's not a going concern, perhaps at £200 a week it would be, which I think you're saying in your last sentence. Your other points make sense and I share your doubt about YA / OxVox running it as an outlet. A volunteer operation may be viable but I think it would need to be backed properly and organised properly. What sort of organisation (apart from OUFC and maybe LW) would want to invest in the Priory? A brewery is one option, are there council functions that could use it - maybe planning? Meanwhile, the first concern should be to protect the Priory IMO. In the long-term that does probably mean getting the lease out of OGB's hands, or maybe incentivising him to look after it, which (as we all surely agree ) means he would have to make money out of it. First step is to stop it falling down....
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Post by woodstockyellow on Apr 18, 2014 9:44:27 GMT
I really think the priory closing has changed the whole match day feel. It used to be the pub that was known for oxford supporters and away fans used to really like it too. Since it has gone there is no pre match buzz. I understand it would not be able to be run as a pub anymore because of location and rent. I work in a pub so i know how hard it is and tim did so well to keep it going for so long. I really think the way to go is to make it a supporters bar. Open it on match days and keep costs low. I dont know how any of this could happen. I really believe most oxford fans really do miss the priory ! the blackbird is just not the same!! #savethepriory
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Post by Gary Baldi on Apr 18, 2014 11:36:06 GMT
The issue with the priory is on non-match days. Tim did a lot of work to stand still. Unless someone comes up with a bright idea to make it both a match day venue that breaks even, and a non-match day venue with similar financial prudence, it's destined to be a white elephant
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Post by sarge on Apr 19, 2014 11:48:55 GMT
The issue with the priory is on non-match days. Tim did a lot of work to stand still. Unless someone comes up with a bright idea to make it both a match day venue that breaks even, and a non-match day venue with similar financial prudence, it's destined to be a white elephant ....that rumour of London Welsh taking The Priory as their offices has surfaced again
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Post by Gary Baldi on Apr 19, 2014 21:08:15 GMT
The issue with the priory is on non-match days. Tim did a lot of work to stand still. Unless someone comes up with a bright idea to make it both a match day venue that breaks even, and a non-match day venue with similar financial prudence, it's destined to be a white elephant ....that rumour of London Welsh taking The Priory as their offices has surfaced again If they are willing to maintain it and allow us to use it without being screwed on costs, great. That said, Kassam never loses out so no doubt we'll end up getting screwed one way or another.
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Post by sarge on Apr 20, 2014 8:05:05 GMT
...IF .. & tis a big IF .... if the cockney-taff eggchasers DO rent The Priory as their local offices ....( and there is no evidence of that happening, only speculation and rumour) .....maybe/hopefully they'll open it as a pub/bar on Matchdays, both 'ours' and theirs..... ( bar take could potentially offset ( at least some of) the rent they'd be paying OGB)
..... lets not forget LW have a much better deal with Ka$$am on their 'fee' for playing matches at the breeze block stadium than OUFC do, so maybe rent charged would be less than was being imposed when it was a pub? ......... time will tell
...... first priority of course is to ensure that the Priory is restored to how it should be as opposed to how it has been allowed to degenerate into!
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Post by mcf86 on Apr 20, 2014 8:15:44 GMT
^^first priority of course is to ensure that the Priory is restored to how it should be as opposed to how it has been allowed to degenerate into!^^
Agree, anyone been near the place of late? If I have time i'll go and have a gander.
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Post by oxymoron on Apr 20, 2014 8:38:06 GMT
Take a camera.
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