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Post by dubaiyellow on Mar 22, 2017 13:01:16 GMT
It really is a game of opinions, there seems to be some exact opposite ones on here! - Dunkley is an absolute liability, get rid / He's been very good for most of of the season - Hemmings is a waste of space / He's scored 15 goals in a team which doesn't play to his strengths Bolton were a great, strong team / they were a boring bunch of giants and we dominated them for most of the game For what it's worth, I'm very much in the second category for all of those... Hemmings has scored 6 league goals in 31 (league) appearances this season (there or there abouts) I personally would rather judge him on that stat rather than the (FA) cup goals (3 or 4 of which came in 1 game). I agreed we should give him time, but he has to improve.
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Post by oufcyellows on Mar 22, 2017 13:17:48 GMT
It really is a game of opinions, there seems to be some exact opposite ones on here! - Dunkley is an absolute liability, get rid / He's been very good for most of of the season - Hemmings is a waste of space / He's scored 15 goals in a team which doesn't play to his strengths Bolton were a great, strong team / they were a boring bunch of giants and we dominated them for most of the game For what it's worth, I'm very much in the second category for all of those... Hemmings has scored 6 league goals in 31 (league) appearances this season (there or there abouts) I personally would rather judge him on that stat rather than the (FA) cup goals (3 or 4 of which came in 1 game). I agreed we should give him time, but he has to improve. What's maguires goals from open play ?
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Post by swinny on Mar 22, 2017 13:24:38 GMT
My first game of the season (shocking I know)...enjoyed it despite the result.
Overall we seemed a decent match for Bolton - apart from at the back where we were the ones who made silly mistakes and they didn't. As others have said they were just that bit cleverer at managing the game as well - knowing when to niggle, hoof it etc to control things - that's where their extra experience/nous was most obvious in the end.
Ref was poor, but I don't think we can blame him solely - we've got to to do better with tracking/reacting for their first goal, less so with the second goal considering how we're setup to defend a free kick (that shouldn't have been given.
Their 3rd goal was just embarrassing though - how you go from a decent attacking position to giving away a corner through a serious of shoddy passes without the opposition touching the ball is beyond me!
We played some great stuff, but at times seem too keen to try and play clever - case in point being the fact that our first goal came from the first actual, decent cross we got into the box from out wide, rather than try and play around them.
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Post by Gary Baldi on Mar 22, 2017 13:32:32 GMT
I'll tell you why I think there is a disparity with DUnkley in terms of fans' opinions. It's just a change in mentality. For every season for the last, what, 15 years?, Dunkley would have been more than adequate for the level we were at. Cnnference, League Two. He's a good CB at those levels. Limited when he comes up against better players. But good. He heads it. He is strong. He doesn't stand on ceremony with the ball. That's all you need. But we have moved on as a team and a club. And fans need to recognise that. He's no longer good enough for what we aspire to be. And as mapp's stated ambition is to bring players to the club who can mix it in the CHampionship, I would be amazed if our excellent recruitment team thought Dunkley was that man in that position. Dunkley will have a decent League 2 or lower mid-table League 1 career. For example, if he went to a club like Wycome he'd probably stay there ten years and end up captain and a hero. And good for him. But we move on. No room for sentiment. And, sadly, no room or time to allow him to improve into the player we want him to be. He will be, I'm utterly convinced, a third choice CB next season. If he's here at all. It's the same thing when we let Beano go. I have a lot of respect and time for Dunkley, he's continued to work hard on his game but he largely is what he is and we have to get better. Once Nelson settled in, he really opened my eyes to where we need to go with the CBs to get promoted and made me realise why Mullins and Wright left. He's most definitely not shit or a liability, but with how we play, we need more rounded CBs.
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Post by Toeby on Mar 22, 2017 13:36:58 GMT
Hemmings is getting so my stick from people it's unbelievable. He needs a partner or at least a player just behind who'll support him. He's not a target man, his game is not about holding the ball up or winning the flick on. Look at last night, playing against Giants and amongst the best in the league. Id like to see him up front with someone like Toney fro. Scunthorpe. Someone he can feed off. Someone bring up his goals from last season. I bet a load are from balls in the box or from where he's been slipped in by a creative pass when he's been on the shoulder of the CB. Wouldn't be surprised to see 3 new defenders in the starting 11 next season with only Nelson remaining. Agreed. He really needs a partner who does the physical side of the game. Hemmings can try running the channels and getting in behind but he will never be a target man at this level who gets his back into an opponent, wins headers and holds the ball up. Last night, the Bolton defenders were 6ft 3, 6ft 4 and 6ft 5 and Hemmings was occasionally left on his own against all of them. People moaned if he lost the header but moaned if he didn't try. But even if he won it (which he had little chance of doing) who would the ball end up with? He didn't have a strike partner. I actually thought we played well in spells last night (and Lunny worked incredibly hard to make this happen) but there does seem to be a perception that we are a footballing side. I think Mapp will always try to get the team to play where possible but we do go direct sometimes. I'd love to see us sign a big brute to occupy centre backs and give us another option.
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Post by MJB on Mar 22, 2017 15:18:10 GMT
I'll tell you why I think there is a disparity with DUnkley in terms of fans' opinions. It's just a change in mentality. For every season for the last, what, 15 years?, Dunkley would have been more than adequate for the level we were at. Cnnference, League Two. He's a good CB at those levels. Limited when he comes up against better players. But good. He heads it. He is strong. He doesn't stand on ceremony with the ball. That's all you need. But we have moved on as a team and a club. And fans need to recognise that. He's no longer good enough for what we aspire to be. And as mapp's stated ambition is to bring players to the club who can mix it in the CHampionship, I would be amazed if our excellent recruitment team thought Dunkley was that man in that position. Dunkley will have a decent League 2 or lower mid-table League 1 career. For example, if he went to a club like Wycome he'd probably stay there ten years and end up captain and a hero. And good for him. But we move on. No room for sentiment. And, sadly, no room or time to allow him to improve into the player we want him to be. He will be, I'm utterly convinced, a third choice CB next season. If he's here at all. It's the same thing when we let Beano go. I have a lot of respect and time for Dunkley, he's continued to work hard on his game but he largely is what he is and we have to get better. Once Nelson settled in, he really opened my eyes to where we need to go with the CBs to get promoted and made me realise why Mullins and Wright left. He's most definitely not shit or a liability, but with how we play, we need more rounded CBs. I'd take Wright back if the Blades let him go personally.
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Post by dubaiyellow on Mar 22, 2017 16:08:22 GMT
Hemmings has scored 6 league goals in 31 (league) appearances this season (there or there abouts) I personally would rather judge him on that stat rather than the (FA) cup goals (3 or 4 of which came in 1 game). I agreed we should give him time, but he has to improve. What's maguires goals from open play ? Simple - Not enough Eastwood aside (who is my player of the year by a stretch) Maguire was our stand out performer for the first half of the season, unfortunately it seems he has not managed to maintain that level of form for the whole of this season. Would he be the first person i try to keep hold of in the current squad - for me no. He is an asset but I would choose others, including: Eastwood, Nelson, Ledson, Lundstram, Hall and Johnson before Maguire.
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Post by Gary Baldi on Mar 22, 2017 16:41:56 GMT
It's the same thing when we let Beano go. I have a lot of respect and time for Dunkley, he's continued to work hard on his game but he largely is what he is and we have to get better. Once Nelson settled in, he really opened my eyes to where we need to go with the CBs to get promoted and made me realise why Mullins and Wright left. He's most definitely not shit or a liability, but with how we play, we need more rounded CBs. I'd take Wright back if the Blades let him go personally. Wright 5 years ago, yes please. Now, his pace has gone and I think we can get better.
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Post by Young Money on Mar 23, 2017 8:30:12 GMT
I'll tell you why I think there is a disparity with DUnkley in terms of fans' opinions. It's just a change in mentality. For every season for the last, what, 15 years?, Dunkley would have been more than adequate for the level we were at. Cnnference, League Two. He's a good CB at those levels. Limited when he comes up against better players. But good. He heads it. He is strong. He doesn't stand on ceremony with the ball. That's all you need. But we have moved on as a team and a club. And fans need to recognise that. He's no longer good enough for what we aspire to be. And as mapp's stated ambition is to bring players to the club who can mix it in the CHampionship, I would be amazed if our excellent recruitment team thought Dunkley was that man in that position. Dunkley will have a decent League 2 or lower mid-table League 1 career. For example, if he went to a club like Wycome he'd probably stay there ten years and end up captain and a hero. And good for him. But we move on. No room for sentiment. And, sadly, no room or time to allow him to improve into the player we want him to be. He will be, I'm utterly convinced, a third choice CB next season. If he's here at all. It's the same thing when we let Beano go. I have a lot of respect and time for Dunkley, he's continued to work hard on his game but he largely is what he is and we have to get better. Once Nelson settled in, he really opened my eyes to where we need to go with the CBs to get promoted and made me realise why Mullins and Wright left. He's most definitely not shit or a liability, but with how we play, we need more rounded CBs. The thing is, Nelson was Plymouths captain and one of their best players, speaking to a few of their fans at the time, they couldn't believe we'd got him and said he was a Championship player in waiting for sure. So yeah it's great that we have him but how many teams in League 1 have two centre backs as good as that? Where would we find another Nelson/could we afford him, or was it just a monumental piece of good luck? Also, fans moan enough as it is that we get bullied by big, physical, long ball teams, so if we did get rid of Dunkley's undoubted strength and aerial prowess and say brought in a really classy, ball playing CB surely we'd struggle even more against the AFC Wimbledons of this world? Personally I think we need two new full backs far more than a new CB.
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Post by Gary Baldi on Mar 23, 2017 9:46:46 GMT
It's the same thing when we let Beano go. I have a lot of respect and time for Dunkley, he's continued to work hard on his game but he largely is what he is and we have to get better. Once Nelson settled in, he really opened my eyes to where we need to go with the CBs to get promoted and made me realise why Mullins and Wright left. He's most definitely not shit or a liability, but with how we play, we need more rounded CBs. The thing is, Nelson was Plymouths captain and one of their best players, speaking to a few of their fans at the time, they couldn't believe we'd got him and said he was a Championship player in waiting for sure. So yeah it's great that we have him but how many teams in League 1 have two centre backs as good as that? Where would we find another Nelson/could we afford him, or was it just a monumental piece of good luck? Also, fans moan enough as it is that we get bullied by big, physical, long ball teams, so if we did get rid of Dunkley's undoubted strength and aerial prowess and say brought in a really classy, ball playing CB surely we'd struggle even more against the AFC Wimbledons of this world? Personally I think we need two new full backs far more than a new CB. I'd say the teams going up will have 2 good CBs and we should aspire to have that. Dunkley isn't the only CB that is strong, etc, but perhaps we'd be better with a more refined CB that may not be quite as physically impressive, but is able to pass better and doesn't get quite so flustered. Dunkley has done amazingly well, but I do wonder if he's reached his natural level with us, or would perhaps be a better CB in a team that plays a different style.
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Post by ontheup01 on Mar 23, 2017 10:04:51 GMT
I Dunkley has done amazingly well, but I do wonder if he's reached his natural level with us, or would perhaps be a better CB in a team that plays a different style. [/quote][
More skilful and pacey fullbacks who can make a difference up the pitch is a priority. We need to stretch teams, get behind them and feed balls into the box in this division
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Post by pottersrightboot on Mar 23, 2017 12:51:32 GMT
I would offer Edwards a contract - he's done very well for us.
Skarz has a year left on his deal. I bet Fat Steve Evans is on his case.
As for Dunks I have not seen a better aerial defender this season in L1. He is never beaten in the air. Bet he gets offered a contract. I foresee a similar situation to Hylton. Personally , hope he stays. A key man in our rise and still has room for improvement.
One poster reckons Wycombe is Dunk's level. Bollocks to that.
Not beyond the realms of possibility that Nelson goes in close season, just a year left on his deal.
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Post by CheltenhamYellow on Mar 23, 2017 13:00:38 GMT
I would offer Edwards a contract - he's done very well for us. Skarz has a year left on his deal. I bet Fat Steve Evans is on his case. As for Dunks I have not seen a better aerial defender this season in L1. He is never beaten in the air. Bet he gets offered a contract. I foresee a similar situation to Hylton. Personally , hope he stays. A key man in our rise and still has room for improvement. One poster reckons Wycombe is Dunk's level. Bollocks to that. Not beyond the realms of possibility that Nelson goes in close season, just a year left on his deal. "He is never beaten in the air." Yes, but that's no good if 80% of the balls are headed to the opposition's midfielders. You may as well let their forward win it. I think Dunks is a great guy, and has added passion and effort to the team, but he has his limitations, and they will be an obstruction to our promotion hopes next year.
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Post by ZeroTheHero on Mar 23, 2017 13:12:11 GMT
I would offer Edwards a contract - he's done very well for us. Apart from being the wrong side of his man constantly and giving away penalties! Joking aside - he has done OK, but I suspect Appleton likes more of of a wing back, less of a fullback. And what about Ribeiro? Edwards was brought in to cover his absence. If he has recovered, do we need two specialist right backs?
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Post by Gary Baldi on Mar 23, 2017 13:31:42 GMT
In terms of full backs, we have Ribiero to get back into the team, so may not need new full backs at all if he can provide the attacking element there.
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Post by pottersrightboot on Mar 23, 2017 14:43:38 GMT
I would offer Edwards a contract - he's done very well for us. Apart from being the wrong side of his man constantly and giving away penalties! Joking aside - he has done OK, but I suspect Appleton likes more of of a wing back, less of a fullback. And what about Ribeiro? Edwards was brought in to cover his absence. If he has recovered, do we need two specialist right backs? Yes, of course we do. Edwards has been our most consistent player since the Shrewsbury debacle
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Post by pottersrightboot on Mar 23, 2017 14:49:31 GMT
I would offer Edwards a contract - he's done very well for us. Skarz has a year left on his deal. I bet Fat Steve Evans is on his case. As for Dunks I have not seen a better aerial defender this season in L1. He is never beaten in the air. Bet he gets offered a contract. I foresee a similar situation to Hylton. Personally , hope he stays. A key man in our rise and still has room for improvement. One poster reckons Wycombe is Dunk's level. Bollocks to that. Not beyond the realms of possibility that Nelson goes in close season, just a year left on his deal. "He is never beaten in the air." Yes, but that's no good if 80% of the balls are headed to the opposition's midfielders. You may as well let their forward win it. I think Dunks is a great guy, and has added passion and effort to the team, but he has his limitations, and they will be an obstruction to our promotion hopes next year. 80% ? What a load of rubbish. Look we all know Dunks ain't John Stones but he continues to improve in my book. And he was ok the other night as well. There were far more disappointing individual performances from other players on Tuesday night - and i'll name them. Johnson, Maguire, Hall , Skarz, Hemmings, Ruffs.
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Post by yellowsarmy on Mar 23, 2017 14:57:31 GMT
I would offer Edwards a contract - he's done very well for us. Skarz has a year left on his deal. I bet Fat Steve Evans is on his case. As for Dunks I have not seen a better aerial defender this season in L1. He is never beaten in the air. Bet he gets offered a contract. I foresee a similar situation to Hylton. Personally , hope he stays. A key man in our rise and still has room for improvement. One poster reckons Wycombe is Dunk's level. Bollocks to that. Not beyond the realms of possibility that Nelson goes in close season, just a year left on his deal. "He is never beaten in the air." Yes, but that's no good if 80% of the balls are headed to the opposition's midfielders. You may as well let their forward win it. I think Dunks is a great guy, and has added passion and effort to the team, but he has his limitations, and they will be an obstruction to our promotion hopes next year. The only issue for me is Nelson has that bit going forward but too often has lost out physically this season. People say we need a more cultured defender to replace Dunkley but against the long ball tougher teams like wimbledon it was our more cultured players that weren't able to match their physicality.
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Post by yellowsarmy on Mar 23, 2017 14:59:26 GMT
"He is never beaten in the air." Yes, but that's no good if 80% of the balls are headed to the opposition's midfielders. You may as well let their forward win it. I think Dunks is a great guy, and has added passion and effort to the team, but he has his limitations, and they will be an obstruction to our promotion hopes next year. 80% ? What a load of rubbish. Look we all know Dunks ain't John Stones but he continues to improve in my book. And he was ok the other night as well. There were far more disappointing individual performances from other players on Tuesday night - and i'll name them. Johnson, Maguire, Hall , Skarz, Hemmings, Ruffs. Indeed if people want rid of Dunks then those (except ruffels because I thought he was OK) had worse performances especially over the season as a whole.
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Post by Junior on Mar 23, 2017 15:08:23 GMT
You really think Dunkley has outperformed Maguire this season?
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Post by yellowsarmy on Mar 23, 2017 16:06:22 GMT
You really think Dunkley has outperformed Maguire this season? Yep look at the second half of maguires season. Even Mapp seems to drop Mags more often than Chey. Take the dead ball goals out of the game and mags has been disapointing at best for most of the season.
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Post by grenobleroad on Mar 23, 2017 17:39:15 GMT
You really think Dunkley has outperformed Maguire this season? Yep look at the second half of maguires season. Even Mapp seems to drop Mags more often than Chey. Take the dead ball goals out of the game and mags has been disapointing at best for most of the season. To be fair he kept us out of being a struggling relegation team at the beginning of the season. His impact has dipped recently but was one of our star performers before Christmas.
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