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Post by lambchop on Jul 31, 2017 17:15:17 GMT
So to sum up - Someone is lying They know who they are We don't The truth will embarrass some people But we don't know who There are a lot of tired dogs Some of them are asleep But some aren't Some people are in the know Some think they are in the know Some are not in the know Some will never be in the know Some know they know Some think they know I've no idea
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Post by Barts on Jul 31, 2017 17:19:23 GMT
So to sum up - Someone is lying They know who they are We don't The truth will embarrass some people But we don't know who There are a lot of tired dogs Some of them are asleep But some aren't Some people are in the know Some think they are in the know Some are not in the know Some will never be in the know Some know they know Some think they know I've no idea I couldn't put it better myself. Perfectly summed up.
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Post by oufcyellows on Jul 31, 2017 17:42:57 GMT
You're right It didn't happen, but there are quite large discrepancies between being told it was and never has been for sale, and fans saying they were offered or asked to help find buyers. And there being no bid despite it getting as far as due diligence. As u say it didn't happen so does it matter? All depends how honest u like ur reports from the club, it's not digging around these are press releases put out by the club that contradict each other. And the owner offering the club to people while saying it's not for sale is strange wouldn't u say. Of course it might not still be the case which is totally his choice, but would surely have just been easier to say- I changed my mind But what is the end point/purpose of continuing to cover the same ground over and over? Well personally if I find someone has lied continually or at least contradicted themselves on several subjects, that I trust what they say slightly less in the future. For example Jeremy corbyn. Everyone knows he says what people want to hear to get votes, and that his figures don't add up no matter how many times he says they are fully costed
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Post by Marked Ox on Jul 31, 2017 17:54:02 GMT
But what is the end point/purpose of continuing to cover the same ground over and over? Well personally if I find someone has lied continually or at least contradicted themselves on several subjects, that I trust what they say slightly less in the future. For example Jeremy corbyn. Everyone knows he says what people want to hear to get votes, and that his figures don't add up no matter how many times he says they are fully costed And how do you determine that DE has lied/contradicted himself based on unconfirmed hearsay on here? All politicians, regardless of party, say what they think people want to hear to get their vote, ie. the continued repeating of the £350m in the Referendum.
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Post by oufcyellows on Jul 31, 2017 18:04:04 GMT
Well personally if I find someone has lied continually or at least contradicted themselves on several subjects, that I trust what they say slightly less in the future. For example Jeremy corbyn. Everyone knows he says what people want to hear to get votes, and that his figures don't add up no matter how many times he says they are fully costed And how do you determine that DE has lied/contradicted himself based on unconfirmed hearsay on here? All politicians, regardless of party, say what they think people want to hear to get their vote, ie. the continued repeating of the £350m in the Referendum. Like I said before I trust what I've heard from people I know more than a man I've never met. And then you have charlie who is closer to the facts than any of us coming out after a statement saying things might not be as clear as that. And Stewart before saying that he was led to believe the club was for sale ,It makes u wonder. Again, I've not said Darryl is a liar, but I think there is enough contradiction and Things that don't make sense to mean I'm not going to take everything he says as gospel. Does it matter? Maybe, maybe not, depends on the reasons. And the contradiction isn't with what people say on here, it's what Darryl says himself. Club isn't for sale, spend 3 months discussing it. Stadium isn't important- stadium is vital. He thinks the oxvox deal is a great opportunity, it isn't helpful, Is still fully behind their discussions. He has a good relationship with firoz, we ain't talking, I don't know how to handle him, we generally have a good relationship I think it's confusion more than anything on my part, and I'm pretty sure I'm not alone in that
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Post by Marked Ox on Jul 31, 2017 18:48:49 GMT
And how do you determine that DE has lied/contradicted himself based on unconfirmed hearsay on here? All politicians, regardless of party, say what they think people want to hear to get their vote, ie. the continued repeating of the £350m in the Referendum. Like I said before I trust what I've heard from people I know more than a man I've never met. And then you have charlie who is closer to the facts than any of us coming out after a statement saying things might not be as clear as that. And Stewart before saying that he was led to believe the club was for sale ,It makes u wonder. Again, I've not said Darryl is a liar, but I think there is enough contradiction and Things that don't make sense to mean I'm not going to take everything he says as gospel. Does it matter? Maybe, maybe not, depends on the reasons. And the contradiction isn't with what people say on here, it's what Darryl says himself. Club isn't for sale, spend 3 months discussing it. Stadium isn't important- stadium is vital. He thinks the oxvox deal is a great opportunity, it isn't helpful, Is still fully behind their discussions. He has a good relationship with firoz, we ain't talking, I don't know how to handle him, we generally have a good relationship I think it's confusion more than anything on my part, and I'm pretty sure I'm not alone in that Tbf on the stadium and Firoz from what I remember DE has admitted he made mistakes. I understand confusion, fair enough but at what point is going over the same ground over and over when nothing really new has been added worth continuing with? This conversation has been going on all summer just like the Checkatrade threads always turned into the same discussion.
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Post by oufcyellows on Jul 31, 2017 18:57:36 GMT
Like I said before I trust what I've heard from people I know more than a man I've never met. And then you have charlie who is closer to the facts than any of us coming out after a statement saying things might not be as clear as that. And Stewart before saying that he was led to believe the club was for sale ,It makes u wonder. Again, I've not said Darryl is a liar, but I think there is enough contradiction and Things that don't make sense to mean I'm not going to take everything he says as gospel. Does it matter? Maybe, maybe not, depends on the reasons. And the contradiction isn't with what people say on here, it's what Darryl says himself. Club isn't for sale, spend 3 months discussing it. Stadium isn't important- stadium is vital. He thinks the oxvox deal is a great opportunity, it isn't helpful, Is still fully behind their discussions. He has a good relationship with firoz, we ain't talking, I don't know how to handle him, we generally have a good relationship I think it's confusion more than anything on my part, and I'm pretty sure I'm not alone in that Tbf on the stadium and Firoz from what I remember DE has admitted he made mistakes. I understand confusion, fair enough but at what point is going over the same ground over and over when nothing really new has been added worth continuing with? This conversation has been going on all summer just like the Checkatrade threads always turned into the same discussion. Because it was only a couple of days ago Darryl released his answers to members questions! That's not going over old ground that's discussing recent events. Hence the thread title ?? It states quite clearly the club isn't and has never been for sale and no bid was made . I think that contradicts what stewart has said, the fact he spent 3 months in negotiations and the fact it went to due diligence. Does it mean anything? Who knows but isn't that exactly what the point of a forum is?
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Post by yellowoptimist on Jul 31, 2017 19:48:32 GMT
Shame we don't go back to the days of Lenagan who could never be criticised or picked up on inconsistency because he said .......nothing!!
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Post by Barts on Jul 31, 2017 20:21:04 GMT
I think the only issue is with the contradictons.
If DE came out and said, we have a budget of £3.3M and the £2M we got from Callum and Roofe goes into the pot then great.
Or if he said we have £2M from the sales, what we as a board will do is add the £1.3M to the budget and we'll knock £2M of the 'soft debt', then again fine.
I think fans just want to know exactly what's going on.
*please note I don't know what the figures are, I'm just plucking numbers out of the sky for an example.*
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Post by essexyellows on Jul 31, 2017 20:37:23 GMT
My word Charlie ..... you do like to make it personal! Remind me how many failed purchases/takeovers, call it what you like..... you have been involved in? If CM dislikes the current incumbent (the person who has actually "put up" for whatever reason) then woe betide them. You can almost guarantee that CM and "some others" will be after you"....but it will be "for the benefit of the club"..... No not our own ego`s you fools!!
You mention JR & Kassam.... there was a big difference FK was (is) ruthless, business minded and brutally efficient in the execution of a plan...doesn`t need any PR pish does he?
I`m just a lowly ST holder...... no more no less...its as much my club as yours chap. Deal with it.
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Post by Marked Ox on Jul 31, 2017 20:38:12 GMT
Tbf on the stadium and Firoz from what I remember DE has admitted he made mistakes. I understand confusion, fair enough but at what point is going over the same ground over and over when nothing really new has been added worth continuing with? This conversation has been going on all summer just like the Checkatrade threads always turned into the same discussion. Because it was only a couple of days ago Darryl released his answers to members questions! That's not going over old ground that's discussing recent events. Hence the thread title ?? It states quite clearly the club isn't and has never been for sale and no bid was made . I think that contradicts what stewart has said, the fact he spent 3 months in negotiations and the fact it went to due diligence. Does it mean anything? Who knows but isn't that exactly what the point of a forum is? Did it go to due diligence, that would require a formal offer? Where has it been stated as a fact there was due diligence other than claims on here. I don't have a problem with it being discussed on a forum rather the same points in this case, as the Checkatrade debate, get repeatedly discussed in multiple threads. Anyway, just about all of this has been discussed endlessly, finally the football is starting!
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Post by Gary Baldi on Jul 31, 2017 20:47:17 GMT
Sleeping dogs need to left to lie. So do the sleeping cats, the walking dead and Santa Claus. Time for thread to step back and have a collective cup of tea.
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Post by 1OUFC on Jul 31, 2017 21:04:56 GMT
Sleeping dogs need to left to lie. So do the sleeping cats, the walking dead and Santa Claus. Time for thread to step back and have a collective cup of tea. I'll have that collective cup of tea with you and let them all lie, apart from the Walking Dead. There's millions of us waiting to find out if Rick's going to die in the next series in October, so please not the Walking Dead.
Although for a Bourbon, we can negotiate!
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Post by 1OUFC on Jul 31, 2017 21:17:51 GMT
I know nothing of finance in football, but there seems to be a possible logical path forward with potential investment for the club that is never talked about.
Mr. Donald, has money it seems, loves football and supports OUFC. He also has a minor stake, but that may be incorrect.
Clearly he wants to see the club do well, so therefore cannot he come in with Eales as a minor stakeholder and put his own money into the club, as part of the investment Mr.Eales is looking for.
He owns Eastleigh, I believe, so there maybe FA rules there preventing this. Can he not combine business with pleasure and invest in his supported club? Why plough money into another football club, if the one you support could use it to further itself?
Again I apologise if there is something obvious I have missed, or maybe Charlie may explain why it could not happen. It just seems logical.
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Post by Gary Baldi on Jul 31, 2017 21:18:07 GMT
Nah, Rick won't die yet. The still I've seen from the trailer is just a story progression. I suppose we could let Tywin Lannister forever rest on the crapper instead?
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Post by Denissmithswig on Jul 31, 2017 21:21:17 GMT
I know nothing of finance in football, but there seems to be a possible logical path forward with potential investment for the club that is never talked about.
Mr. Donald, has money it seems, loves football and supports OUFC. He also has a minor stake, but that may be incorrect.
Clearly he wants to see the club do well, so therefore cannot he come in with Eales as a minor stakeholder and put his own money into the club, as part of the investment Mr.Eales is looking for.
He owns Eastleigh, I believe, so there maybe FA rules there preventing this. Can he not combine business with pleasure and invest in his supported club? Why plough money into another football club, if the one you support could use it to further itself?
Again I apologise if there is something obvious I have missed, or maybe Charlie may explain why it could not happen. It just seems logical. SD has always been very open about him being available to help where he can with the club out if DE wishes and he has also been open to the fact that him and DE have a good relationship. SD will only invest his money if he knows the full ins and outs and whether he sees it as worth while which he made clear when asked if he would help with the stadium purchase.
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Post by manorlounger on Jul 31, 2017 21:27:27 GMT
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Post by 1OUFC on Jul 31, 2017 21:36:51 GMT
I know nothing of finance in football, but there seems to be a possible logical path forward with potential investment for the club that is never talked about.
Mr. Donald, has money it seems, loves football and supports OUFC. He also has a minor stake, but that may be incorrect.
Clearly he wants to see the club do well, so therefore cannot he come in with Eales as a minor stakeholder and put his own money into the club, as part of the investment Mr.Eales is looking for.
He owns Eastleigh, I believe, so there maybe FA rules there preventing this. Can he not combine business with pleasure and invest in his supported club? Why plough money into another football club, if the one you support could use it to further itself?
Again I apologise if there is something obvious I have missed, or maybe Charlie may explain why it could not happen. It just seems logical. SD has always been very open about him being available to help where he can with the club out if DE wishes and he has also been open to the fact that him and DE have a good relationship. SD will only invest his money if he knows the full ins and outs and whether he sees it as worth while which he made clear when asked if he would help with the stadium purchase. Many thanks, wasn't aware of that, as I said.
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Post by 1OUFC on Jul 31, 2017 21:37:55 GMT
Nah, Rick won't die yet. The still I've seen from the trailer is just a story progression. I suppose we could let Tywin Lannister forever rest on the crapper instead? But why is he lying in a coffin looking really old?
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Post by oufcyellows on Aug 1, 2017 5:39:09 GMT
Because it was only a couple of days ago Darryl released his answers to members questions! That's not going over old ground that's discussing recent events. Hence the thread title ?? It states quite clearly the club isn't and has never been for sale and no bid was made . I think that contradicts what stewart has said, the fact he spent 3 months in negotiations and the fact it went to due diligence. Does it mean anything? Who knows but isn't that exactly what the point of a forum is? Did it go to due diligence, that would require a formal offer? Where has it been stated as a fact there was due diligence other than claims on here. I don't have a problem with it being discussed on a forum rather the same points in this case, as the Checkatrade debate, get repeatedly discussed in multiple threads. Anyway, just about all of this has been discussed endlessly, finally the football is starting! Yes it went to due diligence, and ur right you would think that would require a formal offer. Hence why some of us think it strange that Darryl then says he never had one
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Post by Denissmithswig on Aug 1, 2017 5:44:22 GMT
Did it go to due diligence, that would require a formal offer? Where has it been stated as a fact there was due diligence other than claims on here. I don't have a problem with it being discussed on a forum rather the same points in this case, as the Checkatrade debate, get repeatedly discussed in multiple threads. Anyway, just about all of this has been discussed endlessly, finally the football is starting! Yes it went to due diligence, and ur right you would think that would require a formal offer. Hence why some of us think it strange that Darryl then says he never had one Has DE ever said it went to due diligence? All I've ever seen is JS say they did due diligence but nothing from both sides confirming this.
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Post by oufcyellows on Aug 1, 2017 6:18:19 GMT
Yes it went to due diligence, and ur right you would think that would require a formal offer. Hence why some of us think it strange that Darryl then says he never had one Has DE ever said it went to due diligence? All I've ever seen is JS say they did due diligence but nothing from both sides confirming this. Silly foreign businessman not knowing what due diligence means. 😉
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Post by Gary Baldi on Aug 1, 2017 7:25:08 GMT
Nah, Rick won't die yet. The still I've seen from the trailer is just a story progression. I suppose we could let Tywin Lannister forever rest on the crapper instead? But why is he lying in a coffin looking really old? Possible spoilers from the comics I won't share, or some funky camera work...
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Post by Marked Ox on Aug 1, 2017 8:26:45 GMT
Yes it went to due diligence, and ur right you would think that would require a formal offer. Hence why some of us think it strange that Darryl then says he never had one Has DE ever said it went to due diligence? All I've ever seen is JS say they did due diligence but nothing from both sides confirming this. Indeed and this is where I leave this thread.
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Post by oufcyellows on Aug 1, 2017 9:07:46 GMT
Has DE ever said it went to due diligence? All I've ever seen is JS say they did due diligence but nothing from both sides confirming this. Indeed and this is where I leave this thread. Isn't this the whole point of the discussion though ? Juan has said it did, Darryl said he never had a formal offer. Charlie knows Juan and is defending his side, you are defending Darryls. Somewhere along the line something doesn't add up, does t matter ? Who knows but it's ok to talk about it surely? If u wanna take Darryl word as gospel that's fine, I'm remaining open minded.
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Post by scotchegg on Aug 1, 2017 9:56:50 GMT
Indeed and this is where I leave this thread. Isn't this the whole point of the discussion though ? Juan has said it did, Darryl said he never had a formal offer. Charlie knows Juan and is defending his side, you are defending Darryls. Somewhere along the line something doesn't add up, does t matter ? Who knows but it's ok to talk about it surely? If u wanna take Darryl word as gospel that's fine, I'm remaining open minded. As you say, DE says one thing and JS said another. Neither appear to be that bothered about proving each other wrong as no one has submitted evidence to back up either position. My guess, and it is a totally uniformed one, is that any discussion was probably conditional on the stadium being part of the deal. We know how complicated the stadium deal is, and that SD has spoken openly about the finances not adding up even if it was bought. Due diligence may have taken place on the stadium venture alone, or as part of a package for the whole club. Either way, it is likely that either the stadium deal would never happen or (more likeky) it would take several months and would therefore impact on this season's stability. DE pulled the plug, and JS doesn't appear to be heartbroken - we all move on! As with the previous stadium issues, many wanted to paint DE and OxVox in opposing camps. The truth was the divisions were often fairly minor and both have a decent working relationship (whilst not perfect!). Charlie alluded to an embarrassment to the club if the 'truth' were known but appears to be back tracking from that position. I would guess that it would shame all involved if private business discussions were thrown into the public domain. The reality again is that the truth is probably somewhere between the two statements but then business is often like that. There is no real reason to kerp dragging this up as no one seems bothered to provide any additional information.
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Post by foley on Aug 1, 2017 10:13:14 GMT
Indeed and this is where I leave this thread. Isn't this the whole point of the discussion though ? Juan has said it did, Darryl said he never had a formal offer. Charlie knows Juan and is defending his side, you are defending Darryls. Somewhere along the line something doesn't add up, does t matter ? Who knows but it's ok to talk about it surely? If u wanna take Darryl word as gospel that's fine, I'm remaining open minded. I agree with Scotchegg a little on this. Things are probably not black and white. It could well be semantics in what is being said. A bid was put in subject to due diligence. There could have been some things come out of the due diligence, as scotchegg was suggesting this could be to do with the ground, DE could have put conditions on future transfers who knows. It is quite feasible that following discussions post due diligence no formal offer was then put in, it takes some time, DE pulls the plug. So JS put in an indicative offer due diligence was completed and then no formal offer post DD was made. Semantics maybe, but no lies or particular issue. Of course this may also not be right, but it is all total speculation, but it is possible that all are telling their part of the truth ....
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Post by oufcyellows on Aug 1, 2017 10:26:31 GMT
Conditions on future transfers ? If you sold the club ?
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Post by manorlounger on Aug 1, 2017 10:34:49 GMT
Conditions on future transfers ? If you sold the club ? Who would do such a thing? 🤣
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Post by scotchegg on Aug 1, 2017 10:36:46 GMT
Conditions on future transfers ? If you sold the club ? The only assets the club has are the players. The club itself has little value so any sale may include an agreed valuation on the players now, or this could be covered from future sales. Not usual, but not unrealistic given our current position.
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