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Post by ZeroTheHero on Oct 8, 2016 21:33:54 GMT
Not sure we (or OxVox) should forget the past - I think we and they should bear it very much in mind as negotiations/discussions go on...
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Post by Pete Burrett on Oct 8, 2016 21:42:46 GMT
Not sure we (or OxVox) should forget the past - I think we and they should bear it very much in mind as negotiations/discussions go on... I didn't express myself very well. I meant we shouldn't let poor experience of Kassam in the past prevent open-minded contact with him now. I'm sure OxVox's approach won't be shackled by expectation of failure because Kassam hasn't always been the easiest person to deal with previously.
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Post by uptheus on Oct 9, 2016 8:00:39 GMT
Surely until we know more or discussions get a lot further along the track, it is impossible to make much comment apart from to applaud OxVox for their efforts and to bear in mind that those talking to FK aren't wet behind the ears and aren't ignorant of his track record, character and motivations. It MUST be a good thing that at least discussions are going on. Totally agree, which is why I believe all parties have an equal card to play, hence why Kassam won't have it all his own way. We all know that it's ONLY money that motivates him so it may be that he'll either be getting close to his asking price for the stadium or a carrot to make more money.
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Post by uptheus on Oct 9, 2016 8:06:22 GMT
Well yes but ultimately aren't we all out for ourselves - even DE (or is he the second coming of Christ - possibly and I am willing to consider that given what he is doing for OUFC). We may have the best interests of the club at our hearts but that's because the club doing well makes us happy - that may well not be kassams motivation but if we are honest our own self interest is at the heart of pretty much everything we do. I don't see why that's a reason to criticise him he just a selfish human being like the rest of us. I think he's trying to take the higher moral ground because that kind of justifies all his actions so far and actually if he delivers on what he has said in the reasonably near future then surely that would be a good thing for all of us. OxVox won't be looking out for themselves personally, whereas, Kassam will be. Darryl seems to be looking out for the interests of the club, but again you still have to be wary of his ultimate motives because non of us really know. Put it this way, I'd trust him more than I'd trust Kassam.
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Post by manorlounger on Oct 9, 2016 8:31:34 GMT
Kassam made his fortune out of the misery of others, being a hard nose businessman and by being able to ignore any criticism. Unless he passed by a burning bush coming up the M40 or had a short break in the wilderness and a revelation, I doubt he has changed. That said, getting rid of the stadium is not bad business for him. He will struggle for a long time to get the land for redevelopment and the capitol raised by a sale would fund his next venture, whatever that may be. He may be angling for a deal with the council (again!) and that will provide him with more profit. (and possibly lift the millstone that is the Priory from his back)
Frankly, I no longer care what he is, so long as he really is going to sell and be out of OUFC.
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Stadium
Oct 9, 2016 8:38:41 GMT
via mobile
Post by ox4eva on Oct 9, 2016 8:38:41 GMT
Are the council involved in these talks?
If they are an integral part of this 'community' then surely they would have to be involved.
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Post by MJB on Oct 9, 2016 8:41:50 GMT
So what did Eales say live in his BBC Oxford interview this morning? I missed it unfortunately - Jerome said it would be repeated during the station's coverage ahead of the game later but wondered if anyone was listening?
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Post by oufcyellows on Oct 9, 2016 8:42:02 GMT
Daryl said on the radio just now that he was surprised but delighted that oxvox are progressing a deal with kassam. He hopes it can be sorted ASAP and that then it will need a good relationship between the trust and the club, so that the club can improve and expand the stadium to meet the clubs needs. He talked a lot about Oufc being a big part of the community and being there to help serve it as well, so the community stadium could fit right in with that. He also says having made 3 offers he now understands that fk doesn't want to sell to an individual, and he accepts that as it's his prerogative. He also said that fk making it public means it's real, unless he's playing games
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Post by uptheus on Oct 9, 2016 8:42:04 GMT
Kassam made his fortune out of the misery of others, being a hard nose businessman and by being able to ignore any criticism. Unless he passed by a burning bush coming up the M40 or had a short break in the wilderness and a revelation, I doubt he has changed. That said, getting rid of the stadium is not bad business for him. He will struggle for a long time to get the land for redevelopment and the capitol raised by a sale would fund his next venture, whatever that may be. He may be angling for a deal with the council (again!) and that will provide him with more profit. (and possibly lift the millstone that is the Priory from his back)Frankly, I no longer care what he is, so long as he really is going to sell and be out of OUFC. That's the key bit with regards to his motivation, and he knows he needs a companion (OxVox) to negotiate a deal with the council, whereby, he can make more profit, hence why he's more inclined to sell to a trust rather than an individual. Well that's unless that individual offers more than he would ultimately make by obtaining more development land! Agree with your last bit though, it would be good to finally be free of him.
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Post by uptheus on Oct 9, 2016 8:44:22 GMT
Are the council involved in these talks? If they are an integral part of this 'community' then surely they would have to be involved. I'd say they are working very close with OxVox.
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Post by oufcyellows on Oct 9, 2016 8:45:24 GMT
Kassam made his fortune out of the misery of others, being a hard nose businessman and by being able to ignore any criticism. Unless he passed by a burning bush coming up the M40 or had a short break in the wilderness and a revelation, I doubt he has changed. That said, getting rid of the stadium is not bad business for him. He will struggle for a long time to get the land for redevelopment and the capitol raised by a sale would fund his next venture, whatever that may be. He may be angling for a deal with the council (again!) and that will provide him with more profit. (and possibly lift the millstone that is the Priory from his back)Frankly, I no longer care what he is, so long as he really is going to sell and be out of OUFC. That's the key bit with regards to his motivation, and he knows he needs a companion (OxVox) to negotiate a deal with the council, whereby, he can make more profit, hence why he's more inclined to sell to a trust rather than an individual. Well that's unless that individual offers more than he would ultimately make by obtaining more development land! Agree with your last bit though, it would be good to finally be free of him. The key to that bit might mean he has to reduce his asking price. If he's going to get more development land it would more than cover it, then everyone ends up happy. Oufc get a stadium that they are not paying over the odds for, kassam gets rid of it but gets development land, the council get someone to fund much needed housing, as well as a community asset for them to use.
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Post by old on Oct 9, 2016 8:51:29 GMT
Let's not forget Kassam has made a fortune out of OUFC and intends to make even more. In contrast DE has invested/lost £ms in making OUFC a club to be proud of again. The revelation from DE that he has made 3 offers to buy the stadium already, only to be told the the stadium WILL NOT be sold to the club or an individual must really give DE a massive decision to make for any future investments. The club will only survive with the additional income from the stadium and now we know that there are two interested parties vying to purchase this bit of realestate. Kassam must be rubbing his hands with glee. Let's all hope that the eventual outcome does not mean we have to look for new owners for OUFC.
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Post by mcf86 on Oct 9, 2016 9:10:36 GMT
Talk, is, as they say - cheap. fk is the master of promising the earth and delivering only disappointment, he's done this time and again - so what makes some people think this time and this situation will be any different? So I for one do-not blame anyone who treads carefully where kassam is concerned. Nothing to do with 'prejudices' and all to do with past experience/s and taking a 'Once bitten twice shy' stance. If that's 'bleating' then so be it. The more sensible and business-like approach is, of course, to let this proposal play out rather than assuming Kassam is trying to rip us off. When the final deal is available for scrutiny, comments will be worthwhile. Right now, anti-Kassam comments are just unhelpful bleating. 'Sensible and business-like' to what amounts to cupping your hands over your ears, humming loudly and hoping it all turns out ok. If that's your way of dealing with a problem, fine. Personally I'll assume the leopard hasn't changed his spots - until I see evidence to the contrary.
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Post by foley on Oct 9, 2016 9:29:10 GMT
The more sensible and business-like approach is, of course, to let this proposal play out rather than assuming Kassam is trying to rip us off. When the final deal is available for scrutiny, comments will be worthwhile. Right now, anti-Kassam comments are just unhelpful bleating. 'Sensible and business-like' to what amounts to cupping your hands over your ears, humming loudly and hoping it all turns out ok. If that's your way of dealing with a problem, fine. Personally I'll assume the leopard hasn't changed his spots - until I see evidence to the contrary. I think that a sensible business approach makes perfect sense. FK will clearly need to do well out of a deal and I assume that this will happen. There will be a long way to go, but from what I have heard to date it all sounds pretty sensible and Oxvox seem to have some pretty good people running it, so let's hope we get the result everybody wants.
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Post by Pete Burrett on Oct 9, 2016 9:47:35 GMT
The more sensible and business-like approach is, of course, to let this proposal play out rather than assuming Kassam is trying to rip us off. When the final deal is available for scrutiny, comments will be worthwhile. Right now, anti-Kassam comments are just unhelpful bleating. 'Sensible and business-like' to what amounts to cupping your hands over your ears, humming loudly and hoping it all turns out ok. If that's your way of dealing with a problem, fine. Personally I'll assume the leopard hasn't changed his spots - until I see evidence to the contrary. I'd guess you've never had to do much negotiating in your own work life? You seem to be the leopard who's not willing to change his spots. You appear to have one idea and stick to it, but the world is not black and white, it's mostly grey. OxVox have a different view. They are prepared to listen. Maybe this proposal will come to nothing, but at least OxVox tried rather than just assuming they can't deal with Kassam.
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Post by mcf86 on Oct 9, 2016 10:56:52 GMT
'Sensible and business-like' to what amounts to cupping your hands over your ears, humming loudly and hoping it all turns out ok. If that's your way of dealing with a problem, fine. Personally I'll assume the leopard hasn't changed his spots - until I see evidence to the contrary. I'd guess you've never had to do much negotiating in your own work life? You seem to be the leopard who's not willing to change his spots. You appear to have one idea and stick to it, but the world is not black and white, it's mostly grey. OxVox have a different view. They are prepared to listen. Maybe this proposal will come to nothing, but at least OxVox tried rather than just assuming they can't deal with Kassam. I guess you get personal for a reason. All I'm saying is proceed with caution as far as fk's concerned, that to me would be a sensible and business like approach. Of course it would be done in a subtle way, and definitely not through social media. Actually I support OxVox and applaud their work in getting fk to the table, which doesn't mean I cannot have my own views on the matter.
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Post by Pete Burrett on Oct 9, 2016 11:03:50 GMT
I'd guess you've never had to do much negotiating in your own work life? You seem to be the leopard who's not willing to change his spots. You appear to have one idea and stick to it, but the world is not black and white, it's mostly grey. OxVox have a different view. They are prepared to listen. Maybe this proposal will come to nothing, but at least OxVox tried rather than just assuming they can't deal with Kassam. I guess you get personal for a reason. All I'm saying is proceed with caution as far as fk's concerned, that to me would be a sensible and business like approach. Of course it would be done in a subtle way, and definitely not through social media. Actually I support OxVox and applaud their work in getting fk to the table, which doesn't mean I cannot have my own views on the matter. I don't believe I was getting personal. If you read it that way I apologise. Your previous posts didn't suggest 'proceeding with caution', they suggested 'not trusting Kassam'. The first is a reasonable approach, the second unnecessarily negative. Of course you can have your own views, and so can I. Actually, it now seems we pretty much agree. 'We' need to talk with Kassam, and I'm happy this be done through Jem and the rest of the team.
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Post by minime on Oct 9, 2016 14:45:40 GMT
Not being funny but if DE bid £100m for the stadium, FK would sell it to him! But Darryl is a business man and that's not going to happen.. FFS!!! The point I am tried to make is that FK said he wilol not sell to one specific individual. However, IF that individual was to offer a stupid amount of money (not necessarily £100m, I just plucked a figure) lets say £50m then you can guarantee that FK would then sell to that specific individual
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Post by minime on Oct 9, 2016 14:50:30 GMT
If DE has made three bids to purchase Grenoble Road, then were Oxvox made aware of these bids via the RTB?
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Post by oufcyellows on Oct 9, 2016 14:52:12 GMT
If DE has made three bids to purchase Grenoble Road, then were Oxvox made aware of these bids via the RTB? Why would they be? He didn't accept any! Isn't the rtb that we get 6 months to match an offer once he's accepted it?
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Post by scoob on Oct 9, 2016 15:51:28 GMT
Let's not forget Kassam has made a fortune out of OUFC and intends to make even more. In contrast DE has invested/lost £ms in making OUFC a club to be proud of again. The revelation from DE that he has made 3 offers to buy the stadium already, only to be told the the stadium WILL NOT be sold to the club or an individual must really give DE a massive decision to make for any future investments. The club will only survive with the additional income from the stadium and now we know that there are two interested parties vying to purchase this bit of realestate. Kassam must be rubbing his hands with glee. Let's all hope that the eventual outcome does not mean we have to look for new owners for OUFC. Surely DE knows that the Oxvox Board are only interested in the future of OUFC so there is no conflict of interest. The club and Oxvox can/will work together to maximise revenue for the benefit of OUFC. I don't see why DE should feel threatened by this. If Kassam retains the stadium he will always want to maximise his return whereas any Community Trust will initially need to cover the stadium costs but after that they can reduce the charges to OUFC thereby benefitting the club. The two organisations can market events for mutual benefit. Win, win. The only owners who would see it as a threat are those who see their own short term gain as priority. I don't see that DE is in that category?
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Post by uptheus on Oct 9, 2016 16:37:35 GMT
That's the key bit with regards to his motivation, and he knows he needs a companion (OxVox) to negotiate a deal with the council, whereby, he can make more profit, hence why he's more inclined to sell to a trust rather than an individual. Well that's unless that individual offers more than he would ultimately make by obtaining more development land! Agree with your last bit though, it would be good to finally be free of him. The key to that bit might mean he has to reduce his asking price. If he's going to get more development land it would more than cover it, then everyone ends up happy. Oufc get a stadium that they are not paying over the odds for, kassam gets rid of it but gets development land, the council get someone to fund much needed housing, as well as a community asset for them to use. And knowing that he will get development meaning the return on investment is greater than the reduction for the selling price of the stadium, hence why it would make sense to do a deal with the community/council rather than an individual etc.
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Post by foley on Oct 9, 2016 16:42:13 GMT
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Post by minime on Oct 9, 2016 18:42:11 GMT
If DE has made three bids to purchase Grenoble Road, then were Oxvox made aware of these bids via the RTB? Why would they be? He didn't accept any! Isn't the rtb that we get 6 months to match an offer once he's accepted it? That's why there is a question mark at the end of my sentence. Great little things they are. It stipulates that there was a question asked, not a statement made. The reason why I was asking is that as far as the RTB is concerned, I am not sure how it works. Does FK have to disclose that a bid has been made, or like you say, only if and when one is accepted
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Post by oufcyellows on Oct 9, 2016 18:51:29 GMT
That's why I used two of them myself ! I was asking questions as well not telling u
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Post by leftcornerlondonrd on Oct 9, 2016 19:15:50 GMT
I think the battle ground will be around the car parks and access etc....
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Post by old on Oct 10, 2016 6:16:01 GMT
Let's not forget Kassam has made a fortune out of OUFC and intends to make even more. In contrast DE has invested/lost £ms in making OUFC a club to be proud of again. The revelation from DE that he has made 3 offers to buy the stadium already, only to be told the the stadium WILL NOT be sold to the club or an individual must really give DE a massive decision to make for any future investments. The club will only survive with the additional income from the stadium and now we know that there are two interested parties vying to purchase this bit of realestate. Kassam must be rubbing his hands with glee. Let's all hope that the eventual outcome does not mean we have to look for new owners for OUFC. Surely DE knows that the Oxvox Board are only interested in the future of OUFC so there is no conflict of interest. The club and Oxvox can/will work together to maximise revenue for the benefit of OUFC. I don't see why DE should feel threatened by this. If Kassam retains the stadium he will always want to maximise his return whereas any Community Trust will initially need to cover the stadium costs but after that they can reduce the charges to OUFC thereby benefitting the club. The two organisations can market events for mutual benefit. Win, win. The only owners who would see it as a threat are those who see their own short term gain as priority. I don't see that DE is in that category? You may well be right who knows? However DE has come out publicly and confirmed that the club has made 3 bids for the stadium of which 2 have been rejected and 1 is still on the table. That would suggest that his preferred option is for the ground to be owned by the club with full control in the clubs hands. Let's hope the right outcome prevails.
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Post by oufcyellows on Oct 10, 2016 6:40:54 GMT
He did sound genuinely surprised by the news though, so if he didn't know of oxvox work then him buying the stadium would have been his only option not necessarily his preferred.
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Post by old on Oct 10, 2016 7:41:00 GMT
He did sound genuinely surprised by the news though, so if he didn't know of oxvox work then him buying the stadium would have been his only option not necessarily his preferred. I think many ITK may have been surprised at Kassam issuing a statement when he did. In my opinion Kassam used this to deflect "bad press" from his door regarding the fourth stand debacle and the failure to maintain the stadium to the agreed levels. Still it's out there now let's wish for a speedy conclusion where OUFC benefits fully from the outcome.
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Post by oufcyellows on Oct 10, 2016 7:48:37 GMT
Exactly that, keep it moving while everyone is at the table, I'm sure de will need to be involved as well as things progress.
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