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Post by East Challow Yellow on May 12, 2015 6:15:18 GMT
If true, England cannot afford to get beat by NZ or Australia!
The stuffy, conservative ECB are re-iterating their bed and must be prepared to lie in it. I fear for England I'm both series.
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Post by Junior on May 12, 2015 6:48:05 GMT
There will be no shame In losing to Australia. Clearly the best side in the world. NZ not so and I'm expecting a series win. Despite what people say, our 5 day cricket is decent.
As for Pietersen, vey good knock, FC runs are FC runs so fair play. however dropped 4 times and against a shockingly poor bowling attack.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 7:28:20 GMT
There will be no shame In losing to Australia. Clearly the best side in the world. NZ not so and I'm expecting a series win. Despite what people say, our 5 day cricket is decent. As for Pietersen, vey good knock, FC runs are FC runs so fair play. however dropped 4 times and against a shockingly poor bowling attack. Agreed. But how many other English batsmen could do that? And how many other English batsmen had the top average in the last Ashes?
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Post by SteMerritt on May 12, 2015 7:53:40 GMT
And how many other English batsmen had the top average in the last Ashes? Well one. Ben Stokes had the highest batting average in Australia (35 to Pietersen's 29). Pietersen top-scored (total runs) in a pathetic team batting display. He scored less than 300 runs in the series. He only scored 15ish runs more than Carberry, who was deemed to have had a poor series. He only just outscored Ben Stokes despite 2 extra innings. Pietersen was a flop in Australia. As was just about everyone else. Isn't it about time that this pointless (and incorrect) stat was put to bed. LINK: England Stats, Ashes 2013-14.
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Post by East Challow Yellow on May 12, 2015 8:29:03 GMT
And how many other English batsmen had the top average in the last Ashes? Well one. Ben Stokes had the highest batting average in Australia (35 to Pietersen's 29). Pietersen top-scored (total runs) in a pathetic team batting display. He scored less than 300 runs in the series. He only scored 15ish runs more than Carberry, who was deemed to have had a poor series. He only just outscored Ben Stokes despite 2 extra innings. Pietersen was a flop in Australia. As was just about everyone else. Isn't it about time that this pointless (and incorrect) stat was put to bed. LINK: England Stats, Ashes 2013-14.But the facts don't lie, he scored more runs and had a better average than every other England player (apart from stokes). It can't be overlooked. Furthermore, KP has scored more runs than everyone in the side (other than cook).
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Post by Boogaloo on May 12, 2015 8:31:18 GMT
Ridiculous decision by Andrew Strauss. The ECB have merely gotten rid of one old-school, stuffy old fart (Downton) and replaced him with a younger old-school, stuffy old fart (Strauss). When are the ECB going to learn? They have a history of it - Botham, Gough, Swann, Tufnell. Anyone who's face doesn't 'fit in' with the old-boy network' gets treated like s**t and doesn't get picked, regardless of how well they are playing at county level. As Ricky Otto said, "Nice to know that our players are picked on merit".
For what it's worth, personally I DON'T think KP should be picked for NZ - but that is purely on the basis that Ballance, Bell and Root have done nothing to warrant being dropped. But if their form does drop, or they get injured, then KP should have just as much of an opportunity to stake his claim as anyone else. To say he will never play for England again is quite frankly pathetic from Strauss, and we wonder why we were such a shambles in the World Cup?
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Post by SteMerritt on May 12, 2015 8:35:45 GMT
Well one. Ben Stokes had the highest batting average in Australia (35 to Pietersen's 29). Pietersen top-scored (total runs) in a pathetic team batting display. He scored less than 300 runs in the series. He only scored 15ish runs more than Carberry, who was deemed to have had a poor series. He only just outscored Ben Stokes despite 2 extra innings. Pietersen was a flop in Australia. As was just about everyone else. Isn't it about time that this pointless (and incorrect) stat was put to bed. LINK: England Stats, Ashes 2013-14.But the facts don't lie, he scored more runs and had a better average than every other England player (apart from stokes). It can't be overlooked. Furthermore, KP has scored more runs than everyone in the side (other than cook). It can be overlooked, and it should be overlooked. It was in 2013, not last winter. And if it is SO important, why are you not calling for Carberry to be opening? His series was just as 'good' (and I use the term loosely) as Pietersen's was. Should KP have been dropped after that series? Probably not, but that is a different discussion.
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Post by SteMerritt on May 12, 2015 8:38:55 GMT
For what it's worth, personally I DON'T think KP should be picked for NZ - but that is purely on the basis that Ballance, Bell and Root have done nothing to warrant being dropped. But if their form does drop, or they get injured, then KP should have just as much of an opportunity to stake his claim as anyone else. That is pretty much where I stand on it as well. KP needs to build on this innings, and hit another few scores in the coming weeks. The pressure is then on the current middle order to perform against New Zealand. If they do, then they stay in. If they don't, then KP and Bairstow to name just 2 may have their say.
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Post by East Challow Yellow on May 12, 2015 8:48:08 GMT
But the facts don't lie, he scored more runs and had a better average than every other England player (apart from stokes). It can't be overlooked. Furthermore, KP has scored more runs than everyone in the side (other than cook). It can be overlooked, and it should be overlooked. It was in 2013, not last winter. And if it is SO important, why are you not calling for Carberry to be opening? His series was just as 'good' (and I use the term loosely) as Pietersen's was. Should KP have been dropped after that series? Probably not, but that is a different discussion. Carberry hasn't scored over 13,000 international runs and previously scored copious amounts of runs to win ashes series.
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Post by SteMerritt on May 12, 2015 10:12:01 GMT
It can be overlooked, and it should be overlooked. It was in 2013, not last winter. And if it is SO important, why are you not calling for Carberry to be opening? His series was just as 'good' (and I use the term loosely) as Pietersen's was. Should KP have been dropped after that series? Probably not, but that is a different discussion. Carberry hasn't scored over 13,000 international runs and previously scored copious amounts of runs to win ashes series. No he hasn't, but then neither has Joe Root so I'm not sure what your point is. Runs scored in 2005 will have no bearing on any runs to be scored in 2015. History is history. Pietersen has been giving smaller returns against Australia, and that is when he was regularly playing test cricket (home series averages: 2005 - 52.55, 2009 - 38.25, 2013 - 38.8, last series in Australia 2013/4 - 29.4) There is nothing to suggest at the moment that he can arrest this slide in performance. KP, for me, is clear. Hit loads of runs between now and the Ashes squad being announced, whilst hope that one of Bell/Ballance or Root has a stinker against New Zealand. Bell would be most likely, but Bell was the top scorer last time Australia were here, if you can use 2013/14 as a case for Pietersen, then I can use 2013 in the conditions we will face this summer as a counter argument for Bell.
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Post by East Challow Yellow on May 12, 2015 10:43:23 GMT
Carberry hasn't scored over 13,000 international runs and previously scored copious amounts of runs to win ashes series. No he hasn't, but then neither has Joe Root so I'm not sure what your point is. Runs scored in 2005 will have no bearing on any runs to be scored in 2015. History is history. Pietersen has been giving smaller returns against Australia, and that is when he was regularly playing test cricket (home series averages: 2005 - 52.55, 2009 - 38.25, 2013 - 38.8, last series in Australia 2013/4 - 29.4) There is nothing to suggest at the moment that he can arrest this slide in performance. KP, for me, is clear. Hit loads of runs between now and the Ashes squad being announced, whilst hope that one of Bell/Ballance or Root has a stinker against New Zealand. Bell would be most likely, but Bell was the top scorer last time Australia were here, if you can use 2013/14 as a case for Pietersen, then I can use 2013 in the conditions we will face this summer as a counter argument for Bell. Debate over. Strauss has put it to bed this morning by confirming that one of England's top run scorers will not be considered. Fingers crossed the players selected turn up and do the business.
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Post by Gary Baldi on May 12, 2015 13:05:59 GMT
The ECB used to be seen as the gold standard for how sports organisations were run. Now, they are a running joke.
As has been said, KP has to earn his spot and beat whoever was in front of him. His form apart from that innings I don't believe has been good enough. The fact the ECB has hamfistedly tried to exclude him, further illustrates they afraid of big personalities and have little understanding of soft skills. KP has a ton of blame, but the ECB keep escalating the issue. It cannot afford to keep bumbling along like this.
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Post by Gary Baldi on May 12, 2015 13:13:51 GMT
And isn't KP the decision of the next coach, not the ECB?
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Post by SteMerritt on May 12, 2015 13:30:03 GMT
And isn't KP the decision of the next coach, not the ECB? That would be a radical idea wouldn't it, let the coach and the captain pick the side. But no, we have a committee to do that... Who are 'The Selectors' these days anyway?
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Post by Gary Baldi on May 12, 2015 13:52:26 GMT
And isn't KP the decision of the next coach, not the ECB? That would be a radical idea wouldn't it, let the coach and the captain pick the side. But no, we have a committee to do that... Who are 'The Selectors' these days anyway? If talk is true, it's part of the reason Ashley Giles didn't get the job when Moores was appointed. Whether it is a deal breaker with the new coach remains to be the seen. Right now James Whitaker is a selector, but rumoured to be on the outers. And Alastair Cook. Plus presumably Farbrace as caretaker coach. Part of me suspects this is more to do with Cook as Captain than KP.
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Post by Deleted on May 12, 2015 14:36:06 GMT
And how many other English batsmen had the top average in the last Ashes? Well one. Ben Stokes had the highest batting average in Australia (35 to Pietersen's 29). Pietersen top-scored (total runs) in a pathetic team batting display. He scored less than 300 runs in the series. He only scored 15ish runs more than Carberry, who was deemed to have had a poor series. He only just outscored Ben Stokes despite 2 extra innings. Pietersen was a flop in Australia. As was just about everyone else. Isn't it about time that this pointless (and incorrect) stat was put to bed. LINK: England Stats, Ashes 2013-14.For what its worth I thought Carberry was treated very shoddily and can be rightfully miffed. Thrown into the fire and then criticised for not saving the neck of the entire team despite performing no worse than others.
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Post by Gary Baldi on May 12, 2015 21:05:28 GMT
Carberry had a big pop at the ECB in the WC coverage on Sky. But it was so late at night, few heard it. I can't help but feel Lyth is being thrown to the wolves as Cook's opening partner. Post Strauss, a pattern is forming.
The new broom in the ECB feels like the old one. Quite embarrassing. Clearly the concept of confidentiality clauses are met with scant regard
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Post by nige01ox on May 12, 2015 21:36:12 GMT
Agree with what Vaughan amongst others have said in that it makes absolutely no sense to say to him you won't select him due to trust issues on the one hand, then offer him an advisory role to the ODI team in the other. For the first time I actually feel sorry for him as he's been royally stitched up by the ECB. You can't have incoming chairman Graves dangling the carrot of re-selection to him by saying if he gives up his IPL contract and plays for Surrey and scores runs he'll have a chance of getting back in the side, then Strauss within hours of taking the post of director of cricket taking it away. Whole thing is a shambles.
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Post by barmyarmy on May 13, 2015 8:40:46 GMT
A few points:
Kp has scored runs against two teams this season, a university side and the worst county side in the country that hasnt won a game since 2012. After the game he claims he is in the best form of his life.
If Kp's Indian Premier Lge team (whoever they are) qualify for the semi finals he is jetting out there to play for them replacing a New Zealander that is coming to play for his country in England. Whether he goes or not matters little, he is moaning about not being selected but put the IPL before playing for England.
He is a bad egg, he cares about him and his ego only, he wants to be wherever makes his dick hardest, IPL/world cups/big bash and ashes. He doesnt want to go to the windies/sri lanka/new zealand and play in front of empty stadiums. Im afraid he cant have it both ways.
He has publicly criticised everyone involved in English cricket from the top to his team mates in several ways. Im not sure picking him will make the England team better but im sure it will p*ss off many of his team mates that need to be concentrating on other matters. Others are hardly blameless but this guys time has passed.
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Post by Gary Baldi on May 13, 2015 13:10:20 GMT
I'd suggest that there are a lot of sports people who care about themselves only. KP is not rare as its part of what gets them there in the first place.
Is he a prick? Yeah, no doubt. Has he scored enough this season? No. Is there a place available in the team? No. It seems the people in the team that have an issue are Broad and Cook. Anderson seems to be ok with KP now. The fact KP is helping some players in the team behind closed doors says a lot about what they think of him.
The ECB hate KP, and seem to enjoy briefing against him without understanding what a perception issue it causes.
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Post by androidyellow2 on May 13, 2015 14:43:08 GMT
Haven't commented for a while as i'm a bit p*ssed off. Strauss putting his personal problems with KP ahead of the team, shocking decision. I respect the man's guts for making a big decision, but it was the wrong one.
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Post by mooro on May 13, 2015 15:09:52 GMT
Didnt hear the entire interview with Strauss, but the impression I got was that all he was initially saying was that KP was not going to be picked for England THIS summer. He then went on to talk about trust and the need to rebuild it on both sides, and then said that he asked KP to come onboard to advise the ODI setup.
Did he actually say that KP was never going to play for England again, OR could it in fact have been a potential opening of the door by the ECB to say if you have a good summer with the bat and show your commitment to the England cause by working the ODI role, then we can all try to rebuild that trust together to enable your return in the future.
Perhaps it may even have been a test as to how he reacted to that proposal, in which case it is pretty clear from his very public reaction, that this was a test KP very much failed and a sign that he is not interested in working to rebuild relations for the longer term....
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Post by tonyw on May 13, 2015 15:30:46 GMT
A whole bunch of points:
1) KP is taking no for an answer because he's now going to leave Surrey and join the IPL almost immediately. So he's not going to be putting any more pressure on (for a Test place at least) by racking up County Championship runs.
2) Let's not rewrite history - he wasn't just bad in the last Ashes, he was a disgrace. Yes, so were the rest of the team, but we shouldn't be giving him any praise whatsoever for his performances in Australia. Averaging 29 isn't good enough, and the manner of many of his dismissals was pathetic and selfish. I have never ever been as angry with an England cricketer as I was when he got himself caught at long on when we needed to bat all day to save the third test.
3) He's 34, nearly 35, and plays a style which relies on incredible hand-eye coordination rather than good technique. He's not got long left as a top player anyhow.
4) Bell, Root & Ballance all got big hundreds in the Windies (the latter two scored well in general); we need our number 6 to be able to bowl; there's no spot for KP in the current team.
5) Let's be honest, Australia are much better than us at the moment. I suspect New Zealand may be as well. KP is not going to turn us around single-handed. It's going to be a very tough summer (and winter in South Africa!). Therefore I would much rather be playing the long game and looking to the future, trying to build a great side that can win in Australia in 2017/18. That's not going to include KP - I would much rather be giving someone like James Taylor a longer look.
Having said all that - which is why I wouldn't be selecting KP either - the ECB are one of the least competent organisations in Britain, and it will continue to be no thanks to them if the England team ever achieves anything. And Andrew Strauss has made himself look like he fits in there very well this week.
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Post by saddletramp on May 13, 2015 18:11:42 GMT
Im sorry,how anybody can advocate recalling someone who tweets the opposition players with derogatory comments on his own captain and coach,not the coach who he got sacked (Moores) but the next one. Retired as an ODI and Twenty Twenty player THREE years ago. Slagged off the bowlers in the test team (2 of whom are still playing) What about Surrey " sorry lads im off,ive used you but tough shit im back off to India for the cash" The South African-born player is flying to India on Friday to fulfil his IPL contract with Sunrisers Hyderabad.
He also has a deal in place to play for St Lucia Zouks in the Caribbean Premier League T20 competition in June and July. So if he has a contract to play in The WI's how can he play for England ? Or will he shit on that contract like he shits on everyone else he comes across. To see Bob Willis saying he "feels sorry for Pietersen having worked so hard playing at Oxford University and Glamorgan" drives me mad,he's only been in the country about a f@@king Month !!!!!!!!!! And by the weekend he'll be gone again,for good this time I hope P.S. If you had an employee who was tweeting derogatory remarks about you,the said person left the company,then 2 years later came and asked for his job back,would you employ him ? Because Strauss was slagged off to the saffers by the ego.
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Post by Junior on May 13, 2015 18:41:10 GMT
Notice he didn't bat today... Wonder why...
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Post by SteMerritt on May 13, 2015 18:54:24 GMT
Notice he didn't bat today... Wonder why... Scan on an injury apparently...
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Post by Junior on May 13, 2015 18:58:13 GMT
Guess that'll rule him out the IPL then... Or he didn't want to risk getting a low score, surely not.
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Post by SteMerritt on May 13, 2015 19:19:19 GMT
You cynical sod
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Post by Boogaloo on May 13, 2015 20:41:53 GMT
Well here's what the Fuhrer thinks of it all...
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Post by Gary Baldi on May 13, 2015 21:20:11 GMT
Presumably Stuart Broad shouldn't be playing after that KP parody Twitter account?
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