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Post by moobs on Feb 6, 2011 11:12:37 GMT
What does Wilder see in him? He seems to be one of the first names on his team sheet but I don't see what he brings to the team. When he gets the ball he just wants to get rid of it, then he's just running around like a blue arse fly like bambi on ice.
We need a player who is more composed and can pass it like Payne, a playmaker. Clist isn't a playmaker, he's too defensive and just tidies up.
I'd drop Hall and play Payne
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Post by followtheox (the original) on Feb 6, 2011 11:20:18 GMT
What does Wilder see in him? He seems to be one of the first names on his team sheet but I don't see what he brings to the team. When he gets the ball he just wants to get rid of it, then he's just running around like a blue arse fly like bambi on ice. We need a player who is more composed and can pass it like Payne, a playmaker. Clist isn't a playmaker, he's too defensive and just tidies up. I'd drop Hall and play Payne I can see what he see's in him. He is tall, strong, lots of energy and is the midfielder who gets from box to box the most (often in good positions), in other words he has all the attributes to be a great player (Cahill type player) and has lots of potential. However, i agree that at some point that potential needs to be filled and at times he drifts out of games and for all his good positions does not score enough. I agree at times we lack creativity in the midfield. When Maclean is playing well it does not matter as he drops and becomes the creative influence. However, I agree that either Heslop or Payne are very creative although Heslop plays further up the pitch so would like to see him have a run in the team. I think in certain games there is no need to have both Clist and Maclaren in the CM as you are right Clist does lack creativity.
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Post by baldy on Feb 6, 2011 11:37:44 GMT
What does Wilder see in him? He seems to be one of the first names on his team sheet but I don't see what he brings to the team. When he gets the ball he just wants to get rid of it, then he's just running around like a blue arse fly like bambi on ice. We need a player who is more composed and can pass it like Payne, a playmaker. Clist isn't a playmaker, he's too defensive and just tidies up. I'd drop Hall and play Payne He's too tall for you like to him. Why have you got this obsession with, as you put it, 'playmakers' ? Payne was at the heart of the team when we getting pummelled every week and, god forbid, defensive midfielders like Clist weren't in the team. Like any good manager CW recognises that balance is needed and that presence and defensive resposibility are all part of it. Boring, dour 1-0's are what we desperately need now and that means playing those that will sit in and do a job in an unspectacular way.
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Post by ZeroTheHero on Feb 6, 2011 11:46:09 GMT
The proof of the pudding is that the midfield at Southend (Maclaren, Hall, Heslop) failed to challenge for the ball until Clist came on for Heslop. The midfield at Gillingham (Maclaren, Clist, Hall) did much much better. Maclaren and Clist are ball winners, Hall and Heslop do that job much less effectively. If we don't win (and keep) the ball in midfied, we end up hoofing it. Which is when all the trouble starts!
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Post by followtheox (the original) on Feb 6, 2011 11:56:56 GMT
The proof of the pudding is that the midfield at Southend (Maclaren, Hall, Heslop) failed to challenge for the ball until Clist came on for Heslop. The midfield at Gillingham (Maclaren, Clist, Hall) did much much better. Maclaren and Clist are ball winners, Hall and Heslop do that job much less effectively. If we don't win (and keep) the ball in midfied, we end up hoofing it. Which is when all the trouble starts! Not sure one game provides proof about anything. I would not describe Clist as a ball winner as he can be quite weak in the tackle and in some respects Hall and Heslop are better at this aspect of play at times. He does, however, break up play well. he is like a bee buzzing around the opposition slowing them down and what i think he does better than Heslop and Hall is pick up the second ball. I think for certain games you do need both Clist and Maclaren but there are times where we do need either Heslop or Payne to provide creativity.
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Post by followtheox (the original) on Feb 6, 2011 12:26:05 GMT
What does Wilder see in him? He seems to be one of the first names on his team sheet but I don't see what he brings to the team. When he gets the ball he just wants to get rid of it, then he's just running around like a blue arse fly like bambi on ice. We need a player who is more composed and can pass it like Payne, a playmaker. Clist isn't a playmaker, he's too defensive and just tidies up. I'd drop Hall and play Payne He's too tall for you like to him. Why have you got this obsession with, as you put it, 'playmakers' ? Payne was at the heart of the team when we getting pummelled every week and, god forbid, defensive midfielders like Clist weren't in the team. Like any good manager CW recognises that balance is needed and that presence and defensive resposibility are all part of it. Boring, dour 1-0's are what we desperately need now and that means playing those that will sit in and do a job in an unspectacular way. Not sure boring dour 1-0's are needed particuarly (won't do much to get people through the gates!) but, yes, continued clean sheets and winning are needed. Dour and winning don't have to go hand in hand IMO unless, of course, your name is Ian Atkins and then winning and losing both have to be dour!
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Post by yellowadamsy on Feb 6, 2011 12:37:41 GMT
What does Wilder see in him? He seems to be one of the first names on his team sheet but I don't see what he brings to the team. When he gets the ball he just wants to get rid of it, then he's just running around like a blue arse fly like bambi on ice. We need a player who is more composed and can pass it like Payne, a playmaker. Clist isn't a playmaker, he's too defensive and just tidies up. I'd drop Hall and play Payne completely agree i've been saying this to my mates for weeks !
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2011 12:59:58 GMT
I'm not one for dropping him yet because he hasn't been that bad, i think we played worse when payne was in the starting lineup, and thats coming from a big fan of payne, i think he's a very talented footballer. I don't understand why people think asa hall is strong. Just because he's 6 ft 2ish doesn't mean he's strong. He gets muscled off the ball easily, it's his work rate and persistance that sets a good example to the others in midfield and he gives us a good balance. I can understand people suddenly wanting Payne to come in after a 0-0 draw but that was a good point away from home and we can score goals without him. We have a balanced and hard working midfield right now, they are a bit weak but they've been playing well. Might struggle against Chavenage who could win the physical battle in centre of the park though
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Post by Maurice Earp on Feb 6, 2011 13:01:31 GMT
What does Wilder see in him? He seems to be one of the first names on his team sheet but I don't see what he brings to the team. When he gets the ball he just wants to get rid of it, then he's just running around like a blue arse fly like bambi on ice. We need a player who is more composed and can pass it like Payne, a playmaker. Clist isn't a playmaker, he's too defensive and just tidies up. I'd drop Hall and play Payne How many times have you seen him play? Or are you basing your thoughts on reports that you have read?
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Post by longliveclarkey on Feb 6, 2011 14:20:11 GMT
I think Hall adds a lot to the team, but is far from perfect and doesn't have the stamina to cope with game after game, much like Heslop. Hall is strong, he does a lot of work in the centre of midfield battling for the ball, even if he struggles with blind alleys a fair amount. However, I agree to some extent moobs, I rate Payne and I think without Batt we lack a bit of creativity. Payne might be feeling a bit frustrated that, although he may have been inconsistent, he isn't getting a game. He's been in equal measure excellent and frustrating, with a few decent performances too, no less so than Hall or Heslop, and he definitely deserves another game. He's got 2 and a half years on his contract and he's very young, he's a player we want to nurture, not discard. I think Hall looks tired and Heslop off form, so perhaps now should be the time for Payne to get another go.
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Post by Lone Gunman on Feb 6, 2011 15:25:52 GMT
I love this, moobs goes to a game (he claims.) And the first thing he does when he comes back is post a bunch of diatribes against our players and says we only got a draw because gillingham were sh!t.
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Post by moobs on Feb 6, 2011 20:16:13 GMT
I love this, moobs goes to a game (he claims.) And the first thing he does when he comes back is post a bunch of diatribes against our players and says we only got a draw because gillingham were sh!t. I thought I was fair and constructive
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Post by followtheox (the original) on Feb 6, 2011 20:19:12 GMT
I love this, moobs goes to a game (he claims.) And the first thing he does when he comes back is post a bunch of diatribes against our players and says we only got a draw because gillingham were sh!t. I thought I was fair and constructive Weirdly enough I can see on the surface why you have formed your opinion about Hall. I can see beyond it and why Wilder rates him but i guess i don't think you have written anything unreasonable despite having a differing opinion to you.
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