|
Post by paulbeasley on Sept 23, 2017 23:36:47 GMT
|
|
|
Post by maggiesdad on Sept 24, 2017 6:46:49 GMT
Not there yesterday but if it was as bad (or worse) than Blackpool, then I understand your recourse to alcohol. Nevertheless, you have still tried to be objective and balanced in your comments and I appreciate your work. Thanks.
|
|
|
Post by yellowbow on Sept 24, 2017 7:17:18 GMT
As many of us worried/suspected, it looks like we're going to be without Thomas and Obika for a heck of a lot of games this season. As Paul says have things got so desperate that we need to recall Hemmings or do we hope and pray that Mehmeti will shoulder all the responsibility of spearheading our season?
Looking at that transfer market website it states that Rickie Lambert, Ismail Miller, Carlton Cole and Grant Holt are still without contracts. I know it smacks of desperation, but would the likes of one of these be the answer?
|
|
|
Post by paulbeasley on Sept 24, 2017 7:23:58 GMT
As many of us worried/suspected, it looks like we're going to be without Thomas and Obika for a heck of a lot of games this season. As Paul says have things got so desperate that we need to recall Hemmings or do we hope and pray that Mehmeti will shoulder all the responsibility of spearheading our season? Looking at that transfer market website it states that Rickie Lambert, Ismail Miller, Carlton Cole and Grant Holt are still without contracts. I know it smacks of desperation, but would the likes of one of these be the answer? We do appear to have very quickly got ourselves into a desperate times situation. Could we afford another salary though? We're paying lots of players who are not fit enough to play football.
|
|
|
Post by eighteen93 on Sept 24, 2017 7:25:35 GMT
Agree a well written and balanced view. I like the financial insight into our opponents finances and find it interesting and at times very surprising.
I'm staggered that Walsall generate five million pounds of commercial revenue per year at the Banks's Stadium. It looks a well run club.
On to the game itself - it was a disastrous showing.
The first half was particularly inept and you could see Walsall were going to score. We were being beaten in every tackle and challenge for the ball and there were gaps everywhere. I agree Mousinho may have been unfairly maligned by some - he is a good footballer and did OK - but he was culpable for the first goal. The guy ran past him and crossed - the deflection was unfortunate but he should have defended better.
The Saddlers second goal was so simple - Oxford lost two tackles in midfield and Oztumer's simple pass allowed Roberts to fend off Williamson (who was poor) and shoot low across Eastwood (again). Eastwood kept us in it first half with a good save. Agree about Henry being benched for GvK - absolute madness.
It was Oxford's worst home performance for two to three years in my opinion - probably Hartlepool at home under Appleton in his first season.
|
|
|
Post by uptheus on Sept 24, 2017 8:05:35 GMT
Yes, times are desperate and the writing was on the wall after 2 or 3 games, as per Cheltenham game. We've brought in crocks with NO pace, Henry included. The expectancy I think for most fans was that we should make the Play Offs at least, but if we play like the last two performances, and the signs of concern were there beforehand, then we will be in a relegation fight.
I'm really concerned because I'm struggling to see what the answer is in terms of the players we have. Williamson is too slow and his legs look shot. A player of his experience should not be panicking when receiving the ball at his feet, but he'snow starting to make players around him e.g. Eastwood or Nelson frightened to pass the ball to him when an opposition player is within 10/15 yards of him, yes 10/15 yards! My god, what have we sunk to when we're thinking that a player like Ruffels is the answer? Don't get me wrong, Ruffels is a good squad player to have, but shouldn't be the answer as he lacks any real pace, skill/creativity. Yes he'll give a good shift, but the answer? Well I guess the answers yes at the moment which tells me how bad things have got.
Henry is a similar version of Ruffels with more experience I guess, but again, is he the answer? And again, I guess he is as we don't have anything better. He lacks pace, desire, skill and technique, and his legs seem shot as well.
We need to get back to basics e.g. 4-4-2 and pretty darn quickly. If it was me, I'd start with the following on Tuesday:
Eastwood Carroll, Nelson, Mousinho, Ricardinho Hall, Rothwell, Ruffels, Mowatt Payne & Mehmeti (if fit as it's our only choice)
Bench: Shearer, Ribeiro, Ledson, Henry, Williamson, Van Kessel (just) and either Fernandez or Roberts.
Just to add to the above, I'm a bit concerned regarding Pep's comment about Wes at the end of his interview. He first seemed to insinuate that Wes could be out for a long time as it was something to do with his knee, then seemed to question whether players have actual injuries or the desire to play for the club. If this is the case and it relates to Thomas, then I can only guess that Pep is questioning his injury which would then lead me to believe that Thomas threw his toys out of the pram after being substituted against Blackpool, and rightly so. Yes he was having a very poor game, but so we're the other 11, if not worse. The service to him last week was appalling, as it was to Obika yesterday, so this is the issue that needed to be addressed e.g. Central defenders playing in a 4 man defence so accommodating players (Williamson). It was clear last week that Williamson needed to be substituted, bringing Carroll on and moving Mousinho next to Nelson for starters, but Pep choose to substitute Thomas instead making absolutely no difference to the set up. In fact I'd say he made it worse by bringing on Van Kessel.
Concerned, yes I am, very concerned.
|
|
|
Post by uptheus on Sept 24, 2017 8:07:51 GMT
As many of us worried/suspected, it looks like we're going to be without Thomas and Obika for a heck of a lot of games this season. As Paul says have things got so desperate that we need to recall Hemmings or do we hope and pray that Mehmeti will shoulder all the responsibility of spearheading our season? Looking at that transfer market website it states that Rickie Lambert, Ismail Miller, Carlton Cole and Grant Holt are still without contracts. I know it smacks of desperation, but would the likes of one of these be the answer? Getting one of those in had to be better than what we've got, doesn't it? Put it this way, it couldn't be any worse, could it?
|
|
|
Post by unification on Sept 24, 2017 8:12:51 GMT
Whatever our problems are, Kane Hemmings isn't the answer. Five games in at Mansfield and no goals and a missed penalty are all he has to show for his spell so far.
|
|
|
Post by uptheus on Sept 24, 2017 8:15:50 GMT
Whatever our problems are, Kane Hemmings isn't the answer. Five games in at Mansfield and no goals and a missed penalty are all he has to show for his spell so far. Totally agree. I'd like us to go forwards not backwards.
|
|
|
Post by unification on Sept 24, 2017 8:21:56 GMT
Whatever our problems are, Kane Hemmings isn't the answer. Five games in at Mansfield and no goals and a missed penalty are all he has to show for his spell so far. Totally agree. I'd like us to go forwards not backwards. Just dipped into their forum to read their thoughts on him. Understandably they're still in the honeymoon stage in thinking that he'll come good - 'he just needs a goal', 'he shows glimpses of what he's capable of' etc. Where have we all heard that before!
|
|
|
Post by paulbeasley on Sept 24, 2017 8:28:15 GMT
Yes, times are desperate and the writing was on the wall after 2 or 3 games, as per Cheltenham game. We've brought in crocks with NO pace, Henry included. The expectancy I think for most fans was that we should make the Play Offs at least, but if we play like the last two performances, and the signs of concern were there beforehand, then we will be in a relegation fight. I'm really concerned because I'm struggling to see what the answer is in terms of the players we have. Williamson is too slow and his legs look shot. A player of his experience should not be panicking when receiving the ball at his feet, but he'snow starting to make players around him e.g. Eastwood or Nelson frightened to pass the ball to him when an opposition player is within 10/15 yards of him, yes 10/15 yards! My god, what have we sunk to when we're thinking that a player like Ruffels is the answer? Don't get me wrong, Ruffels is a good squad player to have, but shouldn't be the answer as he lacks any real pace, skill/creativity. Yes he'll give a good shift, but the answer? Well I guess the answers yes at the moment which tells me how bad things have got. Henry is a similar version of Ruffels with more experience I guess, but again, is he the answer? And again, I guess he is as we don't have anything better. He lacks pace, desire, skill and technique, and his legs seem shot as well. We need to get back to basics e.g. 4-4-2 and pretty darn quickly. If it was me, I'd start with the following on Tuesday: Eastwood Carroll, Nelson, Mousinho, Ricardinho Hall, Rothwell, Ruffels, Mowatt Payne & Mehmeti (if fit as it's our only choice) Bench: Shearer, Ribeiro, Ledson, Henry, Williamson, Van Kessel (just) and either Fernandez or Roberts. Just to add to the above, I'm a bit concerned regarding Pep's comment about Wes at the end of his interview. He first seemed to insinuate that Wes could be out for a long time as it was something to do with his knee, then seemed to question whether players have actual injuries or the desire to play for the club. If this is the case and it relates to Thomas, then I can only guess that Pep is questioning his injury which would then lead me to believe that Thomas threw his toys out of the pram after being substituted against Blackpool, and rightly so. Yes he was having a very poor game, but so we're the other 11, if not worse. The service to him last week was appalling, as it was to Obika yesterday, so this is the issue that needed to be addressed e.g. Central defenders playing in a 4 man defence so accommodating players (Williamson). It was clear last week that Williamson needed to be substituted, bringing Carroll on and moving Mousinho next to Nelson for starters, but Pep choose to substitute Thomas instead making absolutely no difference to the set up. In fact I'd say he made it worse by bringing on Van Kessel. Concerned, yes I am, very concerned. I think you're even more depressed about it all than I am. Which is a difficult thing to pull off.
|
|
|
Post by manorlounger on Sept 24, 2017 8:31:21 GMT
I held back from posting on the match thread yesterday figuring that I was not in a fit mental state to write coherently so I am particularly pleased to read your report Paul which concurs with my opinions despite, as you say, the red mist descending!
Mrs Manorlounger was called into action yesterday to prevent a. my language offending others and b.my descending from the SSU to berate Clotet in person. Such was my frustration with the team and management. The abject display of inept passing, lack of movement and seeming lack of any motivation on the part of most players (agree, Hall exempt from that) left me seething. The thought that we had parted with a substantial sum of money to watch this for the rest of the season is not acceptable.
How on earth can we start a game with no strike force on the bench? Who do we now play up front with both Thomas and Obika out? GvK is clearly not fit for purpose and certainly not worth the ridiculous amount that he has been valued for if we wish to purchase.
Changes must follow.
|
|
|
Post by uptheus on Sept 24, 2017 8:37:49 GMT
Yes, times are desperate and the writing was on the wall after 2 or 3 games, as per Cheltenham game. We've brought in crocks with NO pace, Henry included. The expectancy I think for most fans was that we should make the Play Offs at least, but if we play like the last two performances, and the signs of concern were there beforehand, then we will be in a relegation fight. I'm really concerned because I'm struggling to see what the answer is in terms of the players we have. Williamson is too slow and his legs look shot. A player of his experience should not be panicking when receiving the ball at his feet, but he'snow starting to make players around him e.g. Eastwood or Nelson frightened to pass the ball to him when an opposition player is within 10/15 yards of him, yes 10/15 yards! My god, what have we sunk to when we're thinking that a player like Ruffels is the answer? Don't get me wrong, Ruffels is a good squad player to have, but shouldn't be the answer as he lacks any real pace, skill/creativity. Yes he'll give a good shift, but the answer? Well I guess the answers yes at the moment which tells me how bad things have got. Henry is a similar version of Ruffels with more experience I guess, but again, is he the answer? And again, I guess he is as we don't have anything better. He lacks pace, desire, skill and technique, and his legs seem shot as well. We need to get back to basics e.g. 4-4-2 and pretty darn quickly. If it was me, I'd start with the following on Tuesday: Eastwood Carroll, Nelson, Mousinho, Ricardinho Hall, Rothwell, Ruffels, Mowatt Payne & Mehmeti (if fit as it's our only choice) Bench: Shearer, Ribeiro, Ledson, Henry, Williamson, Van Kessel (just) and either Fernandez or Roberts. Just to add to the above, I'm a bit concerned regarding Pep's comment about Wes at the end of his interview. He first seemed to insinuate that Wes could be out for a long time as it was something to do with his knee, then seemed to question whether players have actual injuries or the desire to play for the club. If this is the case and it relates to Thomas, then I can only guess that Pep is questioning his injury which would then lead me to believe that Thomas threw his toys out of the pram after being substituted against Blackpool, and rightly so. Yes he was having a very poor game, but so we're the other 11, if not worse. The service to him last week was appalling, as it was to Obika yesterday, so this is the issue that needed to be addressed e.g. Central defenders playing in a 4 man defence so accommodating players (Williamson). It was clear last week that Williamson needed to be substituted, bringing Carroll on and moving Mousinho next to Nelson for starters, but Pep choose to substitute Thomas instead making absolutely no difference to the set up. In fact I'd say he made it worse by bringing on Van Kessel. Concerned, yes I am, very concerned. I think you're even more depressed about it all than I am. Which is a difficult thing to pull off. I am. It's probably because we've seen and heard it for 20+ years before. Yes, we've had a couple of good season, but I feel we've gone backwards this summer when I was hoping we'd go forwards again or at least be as good. I think the main issue, is I really don't think we've got the right playing personnel so basically there isn't an answer. It's like have to fix the car, but you don't have the right tools to do it and it's a Bloody Sunday when the shops are shut so you can't even go and get them to dort it out. And worse, you knew that would be the problem on the Saturday, but didn't do anything about it even though you had enough money in the bank to purchase them.
|
|
|
Post by manorlounger on Sept 24, 2017 9:11:14 GMT
I think you're even more depressed about it all than I am. Which is a difficult thing to pull off. I am. It's probably because we've seen and heard it for 20+ years before. Yes, we've had a couple of good season, but I feel we've gone backwards this summer when I was hoping we'd go forwards again or at least be as good. I think the main issue, is I really don't think we've got the right playing personnel so basically there isn't an answer. It's like have to fix the car, but you don't have the right tools to do it and it's a Bloody Sunday when the shops are shut so you can't even go and get them to dort it out. And worse, you knew that would be the problem on the Saturday, but didn't do anything about it even though you had enough money in the bank to purchase them. That is probably one of the best analogies I have heard in a long time! Almost cheered me up!
|
|
|
Post by Paul Cannell on Sept 24, 2017 9:46:26 GMT
Relieved that I wasn't the only one who got into a 'Beano?' conversation regarding the egregious Genk's Vasoline, as he trapped the ball across the pitch. I was disabused of the notion by my neighbour who pointed out that the real Beano would have been off-side; a skill Vasoline then proceeded to demonstrate amply.
I think uptheus has it (although I'd substitute 'parts' for 'tools', being a pedant). Truly this past 9 months has been a feast of managerial incompetence.
|
|
|
Post by yellowbow on Sept 24, 2017 10:19:36 GMT
I am. It's probably because we've seen and heard it for 20+ years before. Yes, we've had a couple of good season, but I feel we've gone backwards this summer when I was hoping we'd go forwards again or at least be as good. I think the main issue, is I really don't think we've got the right playing personnel so basically there isn't an answer. It's like have to fix the car, but you don't have the right tools to do it and it's a Bloody Sunday when the shops are shut so you can't even go and get them to dort it out. And worse, you knew that would be the problem on the Saturday, but didn't do anything about it even though you had enough money in the bank to purchase them. That is probably one of the best analogies I have heard in a long time! Almost cheered me up! Scrapyards are usually open on Sundays. You can pick stuff up from those for free if you're desperate....
|
|
|
Post by yellowbow on Sept 24, 2017 10:47:26 GMT
|
|
|
Post by paulbeasley on Sept 24, 2017 10:59:40 GMT
Reading that none of them seem able to score many, if any, goals now but - "Matty Fryatt has had his fair share of injury problems but has one of the better goal scoring records out of those on this list." So he'll be the one then. Will be able to keep Wes & Obika company in the treatment room, along with all the others.
|
|
|
Post by outsidethebox on Sept 24, 2017 11:30:51 GMT
I found the Thomas out for a long time then the clarification on Radox that he wasn't all rather confusing. Was there a falling out after the Blackpool game as suggested elsewhere? Who knows. It just seems strange - as did much of yesterday to be honest.
|
|
|
Post by charliesghost on Sept 24, 2017 11:38:46 GMT
I found the Thomas out for a long time then the clarification on Radox that he wasn't all rather confusing. Was there a falling out after the Blackpool game as suggested elsewhere? Who knows. It just seems strange - as did much of yesterday to be honest. Quite clearly the suggestion from the manager was that he thought that Thomas should have made himself available to play. The whole 'of course a knee injury is a serious thing so he will be out for a long time" was a sarky/frustrated gambit by which he just about held himself back from saying that one of his players isn't putting his body on the line. I actually welcome that Pep is starting to see that there are issues to sort out as well as Koolade to hand round. If he grasps those nettles firmly and does what has to be done then we should be fine.
|
|
|
Post by yellowbow on Sept 24, 2017 11:54:03 GMT
I found the Thomas out for a long time then the clarification on Radox that he wasn't all rather confusing. Was there a falling out after the Blackpool game as suggested elsewhere? Who knows. It just seems strange - as did much of yesterday to be honest. Quite clearly the suggestion from the manager was that he thought that Thomas should have made himself available to play. The whole 'of course a knee injury is a serious thing so he will be out for a long time" was a sarky/frustrated gambit by which he just about held himself back from saying that one of his players isn't putting his body on the line. I actually welcome that Pep is starting to see that there are issues to sort out as well as Koolade to hand round. If he grasps those nettles firmly and does what has to be done then we should be fine. I didn't hear the comments but just playing Devil's advocate, could it have been a language barrier thing and Pep was actually alluding to Wes previously being out for a long time with a knee injury and will therefore have a few twinges a pulls that will mean he misses a few games?
|
|
|
Post by charliesghost on Sept 24, 2017 12:09:44 GMT
Quite clearly the suggestion from the manager was that he thought that Thomas should have made himself available to play. The whole 'of course a knee injury is a serious thing so he will be out for a long time" was a sarky/frustrated gambit by which he just about held himself back from saying that one of his players isn't putting his body on the line. I actually welcome that Pep is starting to see that there are issues to sort out as well as Koolade to hand round. If he grasps those nettles firmly and does what has to be done then we should be fine. I didn't hear the comments but just playing Devil's advocate, could it have been a language barrier thing and Pep was actually alluding to Wes previously being out for a long time with a knee injury and will therefore have a few twinges a pulls that will mean he misses a few games? Nope.
|
|
|
Post by ZeroTheHero on Sept 24, 2017 12:20:40 GMT
Quite clearly the suggestion from the manager was that he thought that Thomas should have made himself available to play. The whole 'of course a knee injury is a serious thing so he will be out for a long time" was a sarky/frustrated gambit by which he just about held himself back from saying that one of his players isn't putting his body on the line. I actually welcome that Pep is starting to see that there are issues to sort out as well as Koolade to hand round. If he grasps those nettles firmly and does what has to be done then we should be fine. I didn't hear the comments but just playing Devil's advocate, could it have been a language barrier thing and Pep was actually alluding to Wes previously being out for a long time with a knee injury and will therefore have a few twinges a pulls that will mean he misses a few games? That isn't what he said. At all. www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p05fqqn7 about 37 minutes in
|
|
|
Post by yellowbow on Sept 24, 2017 12:47:14 GMT
Interesting.. sounds to me that the management team think Thomas is fit enough to be playing but the player himself thinks otherwise..? Either that or they don't think he's doing enough to get himself match fit.
I work with a Swindon fan from time to time and when we signed Obika I asked him for his thoughts. He said "f***ing sh*t" before back tracking and saying he's actually a good player but was never fit. He said he was accused of being a bit of a delicate flower for such a big unit and his desire to play through discomfort was questioned. Some players will say they play 80% of the time with niggles and pain while some just aren't prepared to do that maybe? I think Sturridge has also been questioned by his manager in the past so it's not unique to us. It could be argued that players know their own bodies and their limits
|
|
|
Post by holdsteady on Sept 24, 2017 16:39:05 GMT
Got to agree with the comment about our slow playing style, we are ponderous both on and off the ball when we are having one of our bad spells/games. We need to play at a higher tempo, that might create a bit of space for our attacking players.
We were terrible all game, but that first half performance was one of the worst I have seen from a professional football team, it was lucky we were playing Walsall because a good side would of been out of sight by the break.
|
|
|
Post by dubaiyellow on Sept 24, 2017 17:00:42 GMT
My initial reaction when i heard it yesterday was that Pep is unhappy with his players self diagnosis. It doesn't sound much different having listened to it again tonight. History does favour both (Thomas and Obika) players though unfortunately, both have terrible injury records, so if it continues like this, whats the point in holding on to them anyway?, off load them somewhere in Jan and bring some more robust reliable players in.
|
|
|
Post by ZeroTheHero on Sept 24, 2017 17:06:38 GMT
My initial reaction when i heard it yesterday was that Pep is unhappy with his players self diagnosis. It doesn't sound much different having listened to it again tonight. Yes, what I took from it was that Thomas (certainly) and Obika (probably) were all too ready to moan about a twinge - real or imagined - and immediately rule themselves out.
|
|
|
Post by dubaiyellow on Sept 24, 2017 17:09:22 GMT
My initial reaction when i heard it yesterday was that Pep is unhappy with his players self diagnosis. It doesn't sound much different having listened to it again tonight. Yes, what I took from it was that Thomas (certainly) and Obika (probably) were all too ready to moan about a twinge - real or imagined - and immediately rule themselves out. Exactly, how could you interpret that any different?. But what it has done is highlighted another problem besides the alleged injuries. TRUST.
|
|
|
Post by paulbeasley on Sept 24, 2017 17:14:32 GMT
Yes, what I took from it was that Thomas (certainly) and Obika (probably) were all too ready to moan about a twinge - real or imagined - and immediately rule themselves out. Exactly, how could you interpret that any different?. But what it has done is highlighted another problem besides the alleged injuries. TRUST. Which means the "all in it together" thing which is essential for success is lacking.
|
|
|
Post by ryaniobirdio on Sept 24, 2017 17:19:28 GMT
I have been saying since early last season that Thomas is a bottle job who pretends to be injured, goes off during a match and then suddenly declares himself fit a week or two later. He doesn't want to play when things are going badly or look difficult and he's done it yet again here, from the looks of it. The manager can barely contain his disdain towards the situation. Listening to his comments he was clearly less than impressed with whatever has gone down.
But apparently he works his socks off and is super committed. That's all I've been hearing every time I dare to say what a shambolic footballer he is. No, he makes two or three runs at closing down defenders in quick succession, dines out on it for the rest of the game and if he doesn't get a tap in will demand to be subbed as soon as he takes a slight hit, especially if the team is behind and the fans are getting hacked off.
He's a joke.
|
|