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Post by theyellowfence on Mar 6, 2015 7:50:02 GMT
With the news that the FL is considering the proposal for Premier League B teams [after every L1 and L2 club excluding AFC Wimbledon voted to do so], I would just like to ask OxVox if they are in any discussions with the club about this?
To me, this is the single most inportant issue facing any team in League Two. If B teams are introduced in cup competitions then it is only a matter of time until they are competing in the league itself. This would undermine the competition, strengthen the advantage already enjoyed by bigger teams in developing talent and absolutely kill what remains of the atmosphere when "Wigan B" make the trip on a Tuesday night. After signing the biggest TV deal in the history of the game, those in charge seem to demand that the smallest and poorest lose out to correct the failures of the biggest clubs.
The day that OUFC willingly vote to become a training ground for the reserve teams of Burnley and Hull, rather than a serious football club representing our home town in it's own right, is that day that I will stop supporting them.
I would love to know if any such sentiment is being communicated to the club, so they have a full understanding of what they'd be voting for.
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Post by Si Bradbury on Mar 6, 2015 9:09:32 GMT
No, OxVox currently are not in any discussions with the club about this proposal and neither have we been approached about it.
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Post by Jem on Mar 6, 2015 9:26:33 GMT
They'd be my thoughts too 'theyellowfence'! It would certainly be well worth finding out more about the 'proposals'.
We have a Committee meeting coming up and we'll look to pop this on the agenda!
Cheers
Jem
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Post by theyellowfence on Mar 6, 2015 9:51:47 GMT
No, OxVox currently are not in any discussions with the club about this proposal and neither have we been approached about it. Brill attitude
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Post by Si Bradbury on Mar 6, 2015 10:19:18 GMT
No, OxVox currently are not in any discussions with the club about this proposal and neither have we been approached about it. Brill attitude I answered your question in a quick and efficient manner. You asked a civil no-agenda driven question "I would just like to ask OxVox if they are in any discussions with the club about this?". The club website and the Football League have both come out this week, quite clearly, and stated that no VOTE has been taken on this topic. They have asked clubs if they could be given the opportunity to explore it, which all clubs bar Wimbledon approved. OxVox will without doubt be discussing this, as you'd expect.
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Post by Yellowbrains on Mar 6, 2015 11:25:20 GMT
I sincerely hope that, should this come to a vote at the Football League, the club vote in accordance with the wishes of their supporters. If possible, can we add a poll to this thread to gauge opinion which can then be presented to the club to make sure they're aware of our opinions on this?
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Post by sarge on Mar 6, 2015 12:19:40 GMT
Two threads on this running ...one is in the Oxvox section
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Post by theyellowfence on Mar 6, 2015 14:10:26 GMT
I answered your question in a quick and efficient manner. You asked a civil no-agenda driven question "I would just like to ask OxVox if they are in any discussions with the club about this?". The club website and the Football League have both come out this week, quite clearly, and stated that no VOTE has been taken on this topic. They have asked clubs if they could be given the opportunity to explore it, which all clubs bar Wimbledon approved. OxVox will without doubt be discussing this, as you'd expect. No vote has been taken. Instead they asked people a "yes or no" question and tallied up the responses. Definitely not a vote. Sounds like a lot of corporate speak to me. I can see the "no vote" being turned into "it's just the FL Trophy" to "it's just a new League Three" to "Man Utd B at the Kassam? Fantastic!" By the dictionary definition, what you described was a vote. A formal indication of a choice between two or more courses of action. The fact that they didn't call it a vote offers little comfort to me. Were the club aware of the opinion of the match day attending supporters, still a vital source of income outside the top flight, then I find it hard to understand why they have not nipped these proposals in the bud over the last year. This has been reported as an agreement to discuss the proposals in more detail, and that's a big PR coup for those who would like to see B teams in the pyriamid. Therefore I think it's perfectly reasonable for me to wonder if the club are aware of the opinions of supporters. I am not well-connected with this club (mainly because I've not lived in Oxfordshire since I was a teenager) and so I'm going to ask if OxVox are the ones doing it, because they advertise themselves as the voice of the supporters. No agenda, perhaps because I don't know anyone well enough to develop one. I will admit that I didn't know this issue was being discussed elsewhere on the site. I didn't know there was an OxVox section on the forum, because it's at the bottom and I usually access on a phone without scrolling down. Even so, I could not see a single subject title on the issue within "Management" and I don't see why one would not be warranted. Answering with sarcasm because I might not have your contacts really doesn't do much to endear.
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Post by theyellowfence on Mar 6, 2015 14:11:44 GMT
Two threads on this running ...one is in the Oxvox section Sorry Sarge - as mentioned, I didn't know that this section existed until I saw your post. I created this thread because I couldn't see "B teams" mentioned on the front page of the management section and it seemed very topical with the news this week, so hopefully this would let anyone else who only checks the three main forums talk about it.
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Post by theyellowfence on Mar 6, 2015 14:14:51 GMT
I sincerely hope that, should this come to a vote at the Football League, the club vote in accordance with the wishes of their supporters. I hope so too, but I don't know if they will. I have very little faith in the FL being able to negotiate a good outcome with the FA and the EPL. As far as I'm concerned, it fundamentally alters the prospect of supporting OUFC and changes the entire competition. I don't blame anyone for suggesting an idea, but this shouldn't be on the table. It shouldn't be "discussed further", it shouldn't be a bargaining chip, it should not be the subject of something-that-definitely-isn't-a-vote. Just in my own opinion, but I wanted to air it.
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Post by Junior on Mar 6, 2015 15:09:09 GMT
With respect to Oxvox, this question can be asked long before then sit down with the owners. Ask Ashton and the email option direct to him are always open to supporters. You can even ( I presume this is still open ) go & chat one on one to the man himself.
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Post by theyellowfence on Mar 6, 2015 15:18:24 GMT
With respect to Oxvox, this question can be asked long before then sit down with the owners. Ask Ashton and the email option direct to him are always open to supporters. You can even ( I presume this is still open ) go & chat one on one to the man himself. Appreciated, but the voice of one man and the couple of hundred quid he contributes a year can be dismissed a lot more easily than the voice of a unified and independent supporters group. I think that's the main value that OxVox has.
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Post by Jem on Mar 6, 2015 15:45:18 GMT
Appreciate all that you're saying 'theyellowfence' and of course this is an important issue that the Trust will pick up with the Club at the earliest opportunity.
As a first step, we'll write to the Club (next week) and raise your concerns (I'm sure your worries will be shared by many). We'll also ensure that the Trust's Committee discuss the matter more formally over the next couple of weeks and will raise it again at the next meeting we have with the OUFC Board (at the moment this is scheduled for late April).
OxVox will always seek to raise the concerns of OUFC supporters, but Juniors point above is a good one - don't hesitate to email or call the club (Mr Eales or Mr Ashton) directly yourself. They're pretty good at responding!.
Cheers!
Jem
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Post by sarge on Mar 6, 2015 17:05:32 GMT
Two threads on this running ...one is in the Oxvox section Sorry Sarge - as mentioned, I didn't know that this section existed until I saw your post. I created this thread because I couldn't see "B teams" mentioned on the front page of the management section and it seemed very topical with the news this week, so hopefully this would let anyone else who only checks the three main forums talk about it. No probs theyellowfence ..... Though Oxvox do have an Oxvox section on the dedicated Oxford United section on this forum......6th in the 7 OUFC sections (above yellow army below gone but not forgotten)....and yes it is a subject I'd like Oxvox to raise with the management too :-)
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2015 7:43:15 GMT
Appreciate all that you're saying 'theyellowfence' and of course this is an important issue that the Trust will pick up with the Club at the earliest opportunity. As a first step, we'll write to the Club (next week) and raise your concerns (I'm sure your worries will be shared by many). We'll also ensure that the Trust's Committee discuss the matter more formally over the next couple of weeks and will raise it again at the next meeting we have with the OUFC Board (at the moment this is scheduled for late April). OxVox will always seek to raise the concerns of OUFC supporters, but Juniors point above is a good one - don't hesitate to email or call the club (Mr Eales or Mr Ashton) directly yourself. They're pretty good at responding!. Cheers! Jem An excellent reply. By the time of the scheduled meeting with the club the new committee will be in place. In the meantime ask Ashton, that's why RO produce this opportunity for fans every Monday morning.
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Post by aaronoxf on Mar 7, 2015 11:01:42 GMT
Am i the only person that can see the bigger picture here. I think its a great idea, seeing future England internationals compete in a competitive game, would you rather watch Accrington at home on Tuesday and go out with a whimper or watch Arsenal B at home on a Tuesday?
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Post by Jem on Mar 7, 2015 11:03:46 GMT
just for info, we sent an email to DE and MA yesterday asking for the clubs views and highlighting the questions/concerns of fans. I guess Fridays and Saturdays are pretty busy(!), but hopefully we'll get a response sometime next week.
Anyway, time for me to jump in the car and head for Gigg Lane!!
Cheers!
Jem
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Post by ZeroTheHero on Mar 7, 2015 11:33:44 GMT
Am i the only person that can see the bigger picture here. I think its a great idea, seeing future England internationals compete in a competitive game, would you rather watch Accrington at home on Tuesday and go out with a whimper or watch Arsenal B at home on a Tuesday? You are right, it's not the JPT itself - I doubt that anyone cares too much about that particular competition. BUT - It's the attitude it represents and the precedent it sets. Attitude. They think they can just 'invent' some extra teams to pander to prem league clubs, never mind the fact that other clubs have spent years striving to get into the league and the cups that achievement entitles you to enter. Would it mean that there were more rounds of the JPT for clubs like ours to have to battle through? It's not exactly a money spinner as it is. The idea that it would help the national team is fairly sketchy (do Prem teams really give a rat's arse about that?) and in truth it's just a way for stupidly wealthy clubs to get their youngsters more games against seasoned pros. There is nothing to stop them setting up a separate B-team cup or league if they want. But hold on... ... Precedent. They have already been talking about inserting a B team league in between L2 and the conference. Allowing B teams into the JPT is a stepping stone to this, and all it represents. Massively funded B teams blocking the promotion/relegation element of the pyramid (we all know how much the Prem would like that element to disappear so far as their league is concerned!), distortion of the way the leagues are thought of and how high up the pyramid would Arsenal B be allowed to rise? How far would Chelsea or Hull allow their B teams to fall? Would people go and watch Liverpool B rather than their cash strapped local side? Why can't our Dev side be parachuted into local league - it's the same thing surely? So yes, I agree that B teams in the JPT is superficially an attractive idea, but what it represents and what it might lead to are extremely unattractive as far as I am concerned. One other thing. I was watching a youth match on the telly the other day featuring Chelsea. The last player to make through to the first team from their own youth set up? John Terry. That's a while ago!
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Post by ZeroTheHero on Mar 7, 2015 11:37:16 GMT
just for info, we sent an email to DE and MA yesterday asking for the clubs views and highlighting the questions/concerns of fans. I guess Fridays and Saturdays are pretty busy(!), but hopefully we'll get a response sometime next week. I wouldn't hold your breath. I sent a polite email to the CEO (Ashton) after the Mansfield game asking about the superior highlights that Mansfield had on their version of 'yellow player', enquiring if we could do something similar. As of now, I haven't even had the courtesy of a standard acknowledgement that the email was received, never mind an actual answer.
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Post by MJB on Mar 7, 2015 12:40:31 GMT
just for info, we sent an email to DE and MA yesterday asking for the clubs views and highlighting the questions/concerns of fans. I guess Fridays and Saturdays are pretty busy(!), but hopefully we'll get a response sometime next week. I wouldn't hold your breath. I sent a polite email to the CEO (Ashton) after the Mansfield game asking about the superior highlights that Mansfield had on their version of 'yellow player', enquiring if we could do something similar. As of now, I haven't even had the courtesy of a standard acknowledgement that the email was received, never mind an actual answer. That's not good. Working in PR as I do, it's always a great shock to me that some of the most basic engagement activities are missed or outwardly ignored by the club. It's an enterprise which survives on the goodwill and loyalty of customers who will often give the club the benefit of the doubt on issues, even if they disagree with them, if there is an open line of dialogue. I remember emailing the club in the past about a photo taken by an official photographer at a home game. I was keen to buy a copy for use in a relative's birthday present idea. No answer from the club, not even a holding email, so I ended up getting him something related to his 'other club Spurs. He doesn't come to games anymore and I sometimes wonder if something as small as a photo canvas print of him celebrating a goal at the Kassam with relatives, as requested, might have just reminded him about going up to watch his local team occasionally. It's a minor, anecdotal point but it is a small demonstration of how a club which claims to be a community outfit could do much better in communicating with its loyal fan-base.
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Post by theyellowfence on Mar 8, 2015 7:55:37 GMT
Am i the only person that can see the bigger picture here. I think its a great idea, seeing future England internationals compete in a competitive game, would you rather watch Accrington at home on Tuesday and go out with a whimper or watch Arsenal B at home on a Tuesday? I don't think that counts as "seeing the bigger picture" - for one thing, there's absolutely no guarantee you're going to be seeing players that go on to anything at all. If you think about it, the likes of Rooney and Sterling were running PL games while they were in their teens. They don't need to spend a couple of years playing against us. Even if there is the occasional superstar, teams will be absolutely loaded with players you've never heard of that won't have a future in the game, even at our level. I'd far sooner we push our own youngsters, like Roberts and O'Dowda, and see how much they can achieve. Second, if I wanted to see England players play, I would go and watch England or Southampton or Liverpool instead of Oxford. I am aware that those teams exist, and I have made a decision not to watch them. I choose to watch Oxford because I don't think the Premiership and England is the be all and end all. I want to see my local team going all-out to win against the best that another town or city can offer. Seeing a bunch of teenagers, who think they're too good to play at our ground? Who often aren't set up to win the game, but more concerned to mimic the first team style of play and gain experience? Who, if they're in L1, might have less interest in winning since they can't actually gain promotion? You'd effectively be replacing our league fixtures with friendlies. And if you think 51 Morecambe fans was poor, imagine what Wigan B take on a Tuesday night.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2015 8:06:06 GMT
Agree with everything in the above post
Ps think you're being a tad harsh on brahma. I don't think there was any sarcasm and think he just provided a pretty clear status update
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Post by saddletramp on Mar 8, 2015 8:16:01 GMT
Am i the only person that can see the bigger picture here. I think its a great idea, seeing future England internationals compete in a competitive game, would you rather watch Accrington at home on Tuesday and go out with a whimper or watch Arsenal B at home on a Tuesday? I don't think that counts as "seeing the bigger picture" - for one thing, there's absolutely no guarantee you're going to be seeing players that go on to anything at all. If you think about it, the likes of Rooney and Sterling were running PL games while they were in their teens. They don't need to spend a couple of years playing against us. Even if there is the occasional superstar, teams will be absolutely loaded with players you've never heard of that won't have a future in the game, even at our level. I'd far sooner we push our own youngsters, like Roberts and O'Dowda, and see how much they can achieve. Second, if I wanted to see England players play, I would go and watch England or Southampton or Liverpool instead of Oxford. I am aware that those teams exist, and I have made a decision not to watch them. I choose to watch Oxford because I don't think the Premiership and England is the be all and end all. I want to see my local team going all-out to win against the best that another town or city can offer. Seeing a bunch of teenagers, who think they're too good to play at our ground? Who often aren't set up to win the game, but more concerned to mimic the first team style of play and gain experience? Who, if they're in L1, might have less interest in winning since they can't actually gain promotion? You'd effectively be replacing our league fixtures with friendlies. And if you think 51 Morecambe fans was poor, imagine what Wigan B take on a Tuesday night. Pretty sure that Wigan B will not be allowed to play,as Wigan A will be in the competition. You seem pretty wound up about something that hasn't happened,the clubs said they are going to look into it,it might happen,it might not,i don't really see the point of getting worked up about something that might not happen. Also who's to say the Premier league would want to risk their future stars against some division 2 clogger. Where does the championship stand on this ? are they excluded ? Me,i couldn't care less,i think the last mickey mouse game I attended was the scum away when Aylott missed the Stratton bank with his penalty. I will also wager that this scheme doesn't happen,where would the fit the extra fixtures in ?
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Post by theyellowfence on Mar 8, 2015 8:26:56 GMT
I don't think that counts as "seeing the bigger picture" - for one thing, there's absolutely no guarantee you're going to be seeing players that go on to anything at all. If you think about it, the likes of Rooney and Sterling were running PL games while they were in their teens. They don't need to spend a couple of years playing against us. Even if there is the occasional superstar, teams will be absolutely loaded with players you've never heard of that won't have a future in the game, even at our level. I'd far sooner we push our own youngsters, like Roberts and O'Dowda, and see how much they can achieve. Second, if I wanted to see England players play, I would go and watch England or Southampton or Liverpool instead of Oxford. I am aware that those teams exist, and I have made a decision not to watch them. I choose to watch Oxford because I don't think the Premiership and England is the be all and end all. I want to see my local team going all-out to win against the best that another town or city can offer. Seeing a bunch of teenagers, who think they're too good to play at our ground? Who often aren't set up to win the game, but more concerned to mimic the first team style of play and gain experience? Who, if they're in L1, might have less interest in winning since they can't actually gain promotion? You'd effectively be replacing our league fixtures with friendlies. And if you think 51 Morecambe fans was poor, imagine what Wigan B take on a Tuesday night. Pretty sure that Wigan B will not be allowed to play,as Wigan A will be in the competition. You seem pretty wound up about something that hasn't happened,the clubs said they are going to look into it,it might happen,it might not,i don't really see the point of getting worked up about something that might not happen. Also who's to say the Premier league would want to risk their future stars against some division 2 clogger. Where does the championship stand on this ? are they excluded ? Me,i couldn't care less,i think the last mickey mouse game I attended was the scum away when Aylott missed the Stratton bank with his penalty. I will also wager that this scheme doesn't happen,where would the fit the extra fixtures in ? Best to do nothing and just assume those in charge of football have Oxfords best interests at heart? I don't care about the FL trophy at all. My main improvement would be making participation optional so we didn't have to play in the first place. But I see this as another way of trying to ease in League Three, which was suggested a year ago. I believe the top clubs are accustomed to getting what they want and are trying to pass the buck. I might be passionate about the issue but that's because I love this club. I do not want us relegated to being cannon fodder for B teams and if my dissenting voice does anything to make that less likely, I'm willing to use it.
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Post by Jem on Mar 9, 2015 16:12:02 GMT
just for info, we sent an email to DE and MA yesterday asking for the clubs views and highlighting the questions/concerns of fans. I guess Fridays and Saturdays are pretty busy(!), but hopefully we'll get a response sometime next week. I wouldn't hold your breath. I sent a polite email to the CEO (Ashton) after the Mansfield game asking about the superior highlights that Mansfield had on their version of 'yellow player', enquiring if we could do something similar. As of now, I haven't even had the courtesy of a standard acknowledgement that the email was received, never mind an actual answer. It's obviously disappointing that you've had a poor experience in getting responses. This is the sort of thing we can pick up on if others have had a similar experience? Maybe wrong email addresses etc are the issue? DE is usually very good at getting back to people in a timely fashion. Regards Jem
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Post by Jem on Mar 13, 2015 17:17:14 GMT
Just to report that Darryl Eales came back to us today and has said that the 'proposals' are being discussed at the next full Football League meeting in June. There have definitely been no decisions taken and the club will consult if things do progress.
No need to panic is the message!
We will of course keep close to things and will raise the issue again at our next meeting with the OUFC Board at the end in April
Cheers!
Jem
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Post by ZeroTheHero on Mar 13, 2015 18:40:23 GMT
DE is usually very good at getting back to people in a timely fashion. Just saw this, my email was sent to the ceo@oufc.co.uk address, which is Ashton rather than Eales I think. I got the address from www.oufc.co.uk/club/contacts/ and have still had no reply (since 22nd Feb). I'm not that bothered, but it makes me much less likely to bother contacting them again, especially when i was trying to be at least a bit helpful!
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