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Post by grb on Sept 9, 2014 8:37:02 GMT
From tweets I was reading on Twitter yesterday LW appear to be very unpopular with many rugby fans around the country. I hope they f*ck off as soon as possible! What is the particular issues other rugby fans have with them? I'm not exactly sure but a few mentioned that the league should never have allowed their move to Oxford
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Post by Junior on Sept 9, 2014 9:36:21 GMT
did I read somewhere that they signed 25 new players for the coming season. The crowd at the weekend was sub 3,000. Someones maths are shortly going to start coming apart. How can London Welsh continue to stay at the stadium with can kind of support base? I want to see the back of them as soon as possible and economics is proably going to be the major factor in bringing this about! This is purely guess work but I'd imagine the sponsorship money and TV revenue x2 ( Sky and BT ) is a lot better now they are back in the premiership. They will get large crowds as mentioned when he bigger boys come to town. They are also in a European competition so sponsorship from that as well.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 9, 2014 9:37:27 GMT
Mark/Simon You often write/say that OV exists to represent its members and in many ways the wider OUFC support base. Once I'd hauled myself up from the floor from seeing the London Welsh signage on the stadium, it occurred to me that I didn't recall ever being asked for views on the LW issue. I'd like you to seek the views of the membership in regard to them, their tenure in a stadium that is morally ours, their sponsors, their insurgence into the community and the growing and unwelcome coverage in the media ( Radio Oxford just cannot give them enough airtime). Perhaps I'm just a miserable git but I'd venture that the resentment is growing and we should start to act. To me it feels like we've not lifted a finger to make them think twice about continuing their Cuckoo act in Oxford. The crowd today demonstrates that the interest is minimal. No one cares and I think we should be stepping up our activity to see them return to London. Like yourself, and many other OUFC supporters, I would love for LW to find an alternative home as I feel this season more than any we could really feel their impact. It is clear that MAPP wants a crisp attacking passing game, which is attainable now however come January with the winter weather coupled with numerous games of rugby will make this philosophy very difficult to achieve. Anyhow, with regards to LW I echo some of the other comments on this thread in that instead of pressing questions on LW use of the stadium, I, you, OxVox really need to be pressing Eales and Ashton on the viability of OUFC purchasing the ground. Only when the football club owns the ground can we then decide what LW can and can’t do. It was the 4th July the new owners entered OUFC and we were told at the time from the previous owner it was done so because of changing regulations in the planning landscape for Oxfordshire in the next 12 months presented an opportunity for OUFC to own its own stadium. Over two months later and all we have heard is that the new owners have said hello to FK in a lift and had a coffee with him. I fully appreciate that more may have gone on behind the scenes that we are aware off however to me, this doesn't seem like grasping this ‘opportunity’ with both hands. Linking the above to the thread, don’t you think its these questions that should be put forward to OxVox and not about a sign that LW have erected for one day of the week at a ground that, currently, we don’t own? The questions re LW and any others, including those you suggest, are not mutually exclusive. In fact I suggest that they are very connected. If the ability to own a new (or the existing stadium) was strengthened by having them as a tenant then, I, and many others, may have a different perspective. I would like to know what other members and, ultimately, the ownership think about that. If they won't entertain it then the sooner we rid Oxford of LW the better (for all of the reasons discussed above). All I am asking for is for our elected representatives to ask the membership what they think, and what they think should be done (if anything) about London Welsh. It's a democratic organisation formed to represent our views. If I'm in a minority, then so be it. But I think the time is right to see how people feel. If anything it would give the owners a view on how receptive the fan base maybe to tenants/co-owners. As for all those that say "its not our ground therefore its nothing to do with us", I'm stunned. Forget about the legalities, we are the moral owners of this stadium. If not for OUFC there would be no stadium for them to lease. We should not roll over and let FK get away with anything he wants just because he owns it. There is not one single benefit to having them here. Not one. A morally reprehensible situation that sickens me.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 9, 2014 9:40:14 GMT
Ah, the old deal with it argument. We should have meekly 'dealt with it' when Maxwell tried to merge us with Reading. I may never be able to do anything about them, but I will never accept it unless it benefits OUFC. because someone trying to merge our club with one of our rivals is the same as ground sharing with another team that plays a different sport, isn't it? We all hate the Kassam stadium, we don't own it and yet some are getting sand in their knickers about sharing with a rugby team. The pitch thing is pathetic too, I wasn't watching football in the 60's/70's/80's but I can't imagine many were whinging about the pitches back then. It's the same for both teams Nothing like a literal interpretation. It wasn't a literal comparison. The point is, if something is damaging our club, we should do something about it. As for the pitch, again, stop being so literal. OUFC should have the right to put out the pitch that they want and if they produce a bad pitch then it's their fault. Right now, they are not in control of it and that is wrong.
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Post by petechilton on Sept 9, 2014 10:15:25 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Sept 9, 2014 10:23:02 GMT
Mark/Simon You often write/say that OV exists to represent its members and in many ways the wider OUFC support base. Once I'd hauled myself up from the floor from seeing the London Welsh signage on the stadium, it occurred to me that I didn't recall ever being asked for views on the LW issue. I'd like you to seek the views of the membership in regard to them, their tenure in a stadium that is morally ours, their sponsors, their insurgence into the community and the growing and unwelcome coverage in the media ( Radio Oxford just cannot give them enough airtime). Hi oxfordyankee - OxVox members were surveyed about the arrival on LWRFC when they first pitched up (see oxvox.org.uk/news.aspx?id=372). Now that they've been here for a while, it would be interesting to see what OxVox members' feelings are. We'll need a set of neutral questions. We can ask a similar one to the one we asked two years' ago ('What effect do you think they have had?'). Any other suggestions (or anyone else)? Thanks Matt, I don't recall that survey. My thoughts are really simple: Would you support a continued ground share with LW on the basis of a) they are our tenants, with the benefits feeding OUFC b) a true ground share with co-ownership or c) I don't want the filthy Cuckoo egg-chasers anywhere near my club, city or home?
It think that one question gives you all you need to know and would help inform the owners as to the appetite of the trust members for LW.
Perhaps I'm just a miserable git but I'd venture that the resentment is growing and we should start to act. To me it feels like we've not lifted a finger to make them think twice about continuing their Cuckoo act in Oxford. The crowd today demonstrates that the interest is minimal. No one cares and I think we should be stepping up our activity to see them return to London. Of course, there's a difference between peoples' feelings about the presence of LWRFC and whether they think anything/what they think should be done. If you were to put that kind of question to members, you'd need to make clear what kind of action you're talking about. What do you have in mind? I sense that I'm at the extreme end of my dislike for the situation their presence is perpetuating, so perhaps I'm not the right person to ask. However a question such as: Do you support any kind of action against Firoka and/or London Welsh while their tenancy has no benefit to OUFC? If yes, then would you support: In person protest, Boycott of LW matches, Boycott of sponsors - that sort of thing.
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Post by aaronoxf on Sept 9, 2014 12:35:35 GMT
I had a little look at their website yesterday they are charging £35 for a ticket. Offffft thats a lot of money. Would that make their income similar to ours when/if they get gates averaging 2,500/3,000?
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Post by mdh on Sept 9, 2014 15:05:24 GMT
Always believed most of the London Welsh home support at the Kassam was made up of away fans !
Are the fans from london starting to disappear ?
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Post by Colin B on Sept 9, 2014 19:32:59 GMT
Like yourself, and many other OUFC supporters, I would love for LW to find an alternative home as I feel this season more than any we could really feel their impact. It is clear that MAPP wants a crisp attacking passing game, which is attainable now however come January with the winter weather coupled with numerous games of rugby will make this philosophy very difficult to achieve. Anyhow, with regards to LW I echo some of the other comments on this thread in that instead of pressing questions on LW use of the stadium, I, you, OxVox really need to be pressing Eales and Ashton on the viability of OUFC purchasing the ground. Only when the football club owns the ground can we then decide what LW can and can’t do. It was the 4th July the new owners entered OUFC and we were told at the time from the previous owner it was done so because of changing regulations in the planning landscape for Oxfordshire in the next 12 months presented an opportunity for OUFC to own its own stadium. Over two months later and all we have heard is that the new owners have said hello to FK in a lift and had a coffee with him. I fully appreciate that more may have gone on behind the scenes that we are aware off however to me, this doesn't seem like grasping this ‘opportunity’ with both hands. Linking the above to the thread, don’t you think its these questions that should be put forward to OxVox and not about a sign that LW have erected for one day of the week at a ground that, currently, we don’t own? The questions re LW and any others, including those you suggest, are not mutually exclusive. In fact I suggest that they are very connected. If the ability to own a new (or the existing stadium) was strengthened by having them as a tenant then, I, and many others, may have a different perspective. I would like to know what other members and, ultimately, the ownership think about that. If they won't entertain it then the sooner we rid Oxford of LW the better (for all of the reasons discussed above). All I am asking for is for our elected representatives to ask the membership what they think, and what they think should be done (if anything) about London Welsh. It's a democratic organisation formed to represent our views. If I'm in a minority, then so be it. But I think the time is right to see how people feel. If anything it would give the owners a view on how receptive the fan base maybe to tenants/co-owners. As for all those that say "its not our ground therefore its nothing to do with us", I'm stunned. Forget about the legalities, we are the moral owners of this stadium. If not for OUFC there would be no stadium for them to lease. We should not roll over and let FK get away with anything he wants just because he owns it. There is not one single benefit to having them here. Not one. A morally reprehensible situation that sickens me. Hear hear. Nail on the head, especially the last paragraph.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 9, 2014 20:43:13 GMT
The questions re LW and any others, including those you suggest, are not mutually exclusive. In fact I suggest that they are very connected. If the ability to own a new (or the existing stadium) was strengthened by having them as a tenant then, I, and many others, may have a different perspective. I would like to know what other members and, ultimately, the ownership think about that. If they won't entertain it then the sooner we rid Oxford of LW the better (for all of the reasons discussed above). All I am asking for is for our elected representatives to ask the membership what they think, and what they think should be done (if anything) about London Welsh. It's a democratic organisation formed to represent our views. If I'm in a minority, then so be it. But I think the time is right to see how people feel. If anything it would give the owners a view on how receptive the fan base maybe to tenants/co-owners. As for all those that say "its not our ground therefore its nothing to do with us", I'm stunned. Forget about the legalities, we are the moral owners of this stadium.If not for OUFC there would be no stadium for them to lease. We should not roll over and let FK get away with anything he wants just because he owns it. There is not one single benefit to having them here. Not one. A morally reprehensible situation that sickens me. Hear hear. Nail on the head, especially the last paragraph. If not for OUFC? Surely the new stadium was down to Firoz?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 9, 2014 21:40:08 GMT
You think he would have built it without OUFC to play in it? You think he would have got planning for everything else without OUFC being used as a pawn in his game with the Council?
Think again.
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Post by chappers on Sept 9, 2014 23:31:52 GMT
Mark/Simon You often write/say that OV exists to represent its members and in many ways the wider OUFC support base. Once I'd hauled myself up from the floor from seeing the London Welsh signage on the stadium, it occurred to me that I didn't recall ever being asked for views on the LW issue. I'd like you to seek the views of the membership in regard to them, their tenure in a stadium that is morally ours, their sponsors, their insurgence into the community and the growing and unwelcome coverage in the media ( Radio Oxford just cannot give them enough airtime). Perhaps I'm just a miserable git but I'd venture that the resentment is growing and we should start to act. To me it feels like we've not lifted a finger to make them think twice about continuing their Cuckoo act in Oxford. The crowd today demonstrates that the interest is minimal. No one cares and I think we should be stepping up our activity to see them return to London. Really think you need to decide as what or who you really object and where your grievances lie. I really fail to see the concern of Oxford fans and fans of other rugby clubs for that matter, as to LW's attendances, finances or dealings they have with our current common landlord, if OUFC think that LW being present is detrimental or in some way breaching their rights then representation should be made towards Firoka. Maybe your angst would be better directed towards OUFC or Mr K. and the negotiations that originally separated the club from the ground As for sponsorship, the community and the media coverage, get over it, the same opportunities are there for both clubs, go out and fight for your own share of that. Kassam will do whatever he pleases to the detriment of either club, I would guess, if it suits, so long as he doesn't breach either contract. On the specifics of the signage, how would you feel if OUFC were the LL and LW the tenant paying for the privilege and if you were unhappy where would you vent you anger. I just find it strange that all this has come up again co-inciding with a lack of form on the pitch, its been exactly the same over on the LW board after a thumping by Exeter. LW may not be a success in Oxford and they may run off somewhere else with their tail between their legs, but I can assure you it wont be because of some sort of matchday protest, as I said if you have genuine grievance with LW then direct it to them or via your own club, if it's just because you don't like the fact that you are no longer the only show in town, then think again before taking the actions you suggest.
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Post by chappers on Sept 9, 2014 23:50:09 GMT
Always believed most of the London Welsh home support at the Kassam was made up of away fans ! Are the fans from london starting to disappear ? In answer to your question based on last week, the crowd was made up of I would estimate around 400 Exeter supporters, around the same from the original London support and the rest from the local Oxford area.
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Post by chuckbert on Sept 10, 2014 0:25:24 GMT
How do you tell the difference between London London Welsh fans and Oxford London Welsh fans? Seriously though folks, my question would be "What is the desired outcome of a protest?". I can imagine it creating some bad feeling that would probably mystify most LW fans. I can't imagine that it would cause LW to up sticks or for any fans to say "you're right, now I'm going to stop attending". It might make people like the OP feel better, but not sure what else.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2014 5:40:18 GMT
Chappers, I have no issue specifically with LW. Nor would I have an issue with any club IF their presence had significant benefit to OUFC.
Perhaps I'm missing something. Feel free to point out what good comes to OUFC.
No doubt you'll take the position of 'blame Firoka, we're just a tenant'. I understand that, but whenever you or other LW fans write I get no sense of empathy for us from you. None whatsoever. The impression I get is that you feel that we should be cock-a-hoop that you've deigned to bring LW to town.
Maybe that's the benefit you see for us.
Anyway, I've got the response from OV that I wanted. I'll now retire from the thread and await any further comms from them.
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Post by chappers on Sept 10, 2014 6:13:32 GMT
It's not about being cock-a-hoop about LW but surely about seeing the bigger picture and how an increased professional sporting profile is good for the City and in turn good for the sides involved. Can't do much about the tenancy situation now. As for any sort of empathy towards OUFC, be aware that LW rocked up in town and some may not have liked the way they went about their business, but there was never any slagging off of OUFC, telling them what they should do or where they should play, no one shouting at fans in the street telling them to "F off back to Wales you Taff" because they were wearing a LW shirt in town, as happened to a friend of mine. Empathy comes from a mutal understanding and acceptance, which clearly at present doesn't exist.
My original point though was that I don't see how a protest, boycott of sponsors etc is good for anyone and that includes OUFC
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Post by oufcyellows on Sept 10, 2014 6:17:41 GMT
It's not about being cock-a-hoop about LW but surely about seeing the bigger picture and how an increased professional sporting profile is good for the City and in turn good for the sides involved. Can't do much about the tenancy situation now. As for any sort of empathy towards OUFC, be aware that LW rocked up in town and some may not have liked the way they went about their business, but there was never any slagging off of OUFC, telling them what they should do or where they should play, no one shouting at fans in the street telling them to "F off back to Wales you Taff" because they were wearing a LW shirt in town, as happened to a friend of mine. Empathy comes from a mutal understanding and acceptance, which clearly at present doesn't exist. My original point though was that I don't see how a protest, boycott of sponsors etc is good for anyone and that includes OUFC To be fair mate u been here 3 years and I wouldn't recognise a lw shirt if I was given in free in town. U would have to point out what team it was before I could tell you to f*ck off back to Wales
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2014 6:24:10 GMT
It's not about being cock-a-hoop about LW but surely about seeing the bigger picture and how an increased professional sporting profile is good for the City and in turn good for the sides involved. Can't do much about the tenancy situation now. As for any sort of empathy towards OUFC, be aware that LW rocked up in town and some may not have liked the way they went about their business, but there was never any slagging off of OUFC, telling them what they should do or where they should play, no one shouting at fans in the street telling them to "F off back to Wales you Taff" because they were wearing a LW shirt in town, as happened to a friend of mine. Empathy comes from a mutal understanding and acceptance, which clearly at present doesn't exist. My original point though was that I don't see how a protest, boycott of sponsors etc is good for anyone and that includes OUFC Pretty flimsy argument for how that benefits oufc. Anything tangible tucked up in there?
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Post by stevegilbert on Sept 10, 2014 8:05:37 GMT
I honestly can't see how a protest would help in any way or achieve anything. We don't own the stadium which means we don't get a say in who else uses it when we aren't. Until we do own the ground then this situation is not going to change.
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Post by chappers on Sept 10, 2014 18:57:54 GMT
It's not about being cock-a-hoop about LW but surely about seeing the bigger picture and how an increased professional sporting profile is good for the City and in turn good for the sides involved. Can't do much about the tenancy situation now. As for any sort of empathy towards OUFC, be aware that LW rocked up in town and some may not have liked the way they went about their business, but there was never any slagging off of OUFC, telling them what they should do or where they should play, no one shouting at fans in the street telling them to "F off back to Wales you Taff" because they were wearing a LW shirt in town, as happened to a friend of mine. Empathy comes from a mutal understanding and acceptance, which clearly at present doesn't exist. My original point though was that I don't see how a protest, boycott of sponsors etc is good for anyone and that includes OUFC Pretty flimsy argument for how that benefits oufc. Anything tangible tucked up in there? You might not think that there are many benefits to OUFC from having LW in town and it may be that you are right, but animosity and negativity, certainly won't improve the situation or highlight any positives
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Post by oufcyellows on Sept 10, 2014 19:02:34 GMT
Pretty flimsy argument for how that benefits oufc. Anything tangible tucked up in there? You might not think that there are many benefits to OUFC from having LW in town and it may be that you are right, but animosity and negativity, certainly won't improve the situation or highlight any positives I think the only answer here is, as a good will gesture lw buy the priory do it up and open it on both rugby and footy match days, integrating them self into the community and making a nice atmosphere for both parties
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Post by Colin B on Sept 10, 2014 19:29:53 GMT
Pretty flimsy argument for how that benefits oufc. Anything tangible tucked up in there? You might not think that there are many benefits to OUFC from having LW in town and it may be that you are right, but animosity and negativity, certainly won't improve the situation or highlight any positives Says the antagonistic, rugby man.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2014 19:58:00 GMT
Pretty flimsy argument for how that benefits oufc. Anything tangible tucked up in there? You might not think that there are many benefits to OUFC from having LW in town and it may be that you are right, but animosity and negativity, certainly won't improve the situation or highlight any positives It may actually. A well behaved protest outside the turnstiles may make people feel that they don't want to attend sport under that shadow. Who knows. Given people have finite income, the pitch is being pilloried, and the stadium price is likely to benefit, from a self- interest perspective that may make sense to us. I'm sure with your oxford united hat on you could see that.
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Post by sarge on Sept 11, 2014 11:12:19 GMT
Isnt is correct LW are on a 3 year contract to play at the stadium?( subject to Premiership status???)
any protests targetting LW arent really gonna make any real difference
besides, a protest that would be worth turning up for, IMO, would be outside Firoka/ Stadco offices and about the sorry n sad state that its degenerated into ( facilities and playing surface)
Also, look at what LW have got Ka$$am to agree to on matchdays, THEY have an outside bar with real ales etc, currently all we have is the unwelcoming Manor bar. If Yellow Army really wanted to 'improve the matchday experience' theres a start point that Ka$$am has already agreed to ...
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Post by browny on Sept 12, 2014 11:10:14 GMT
Not sure I get any of this talk of protesting to be honest.
Personally I could not give a damn about LW, there are as entitled to hire the stadium as we are and the only time we have any call on what happens is if the club purchase the stadium. If this happens we would all be sitting here saying its a good thing having them because they are paying rent. Would the club owners give up the revenue ? Not sure I believe they would
Lets be honest despite 25 new signings they were walloped and I suspect relegation is a real possibility again for them, maybe that would then be the catalyst for them to go away
Until they do any protest is pointless and really a bit petty to be honest
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Post by myles on Sept 12, 2014 14:26:37 GMT
Personally I could not give a damn about LW, there are as entitled to hire the stadium as we are and the only time we have any call on what happens is if the club purchase the stadium. If this happens we would all be sitting here saying its a good thing having them because they are paying rent. Would the club owners give up the revenue ? Not sure I believe they would Personally, I think this is a key point. Whilst we are also tenants of the stadium, the benefits to OUFC are absolutely marginal. If, however, we owned the stadium, it would be a different matter. Not only would LW be paying rent, but we would also be in a position to ensure that the pitch is installed and maintained in such a way as to allow dual use, as happens at a number of other grounds.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 12, 2014 15:01:04 GMT
Personally I could not give a damn about LW, there are as entitled to hire the stadium as we are and the only time we have any call on what happens is if the club purchase the stadium. If this happens we would all be sitting here saying its a good thing having them because they are paying rent. Would the club owners give up the revenue ? Not sure I believe they would Personally, I think this is a key point. Whilst we are also tenants of the stadium, the benefits to OUFC are absolutely marginal. If, however, we owned the stadium, it would be a different matter. Not only would LW be paying rent, but we would also be in a position to ensure that the pitch is installed and maintained in such a way as to allow dual use, as happens at a number of other grounds. Totally agree. The fault lies with Firoz Kassam not LW. Kassam takes the rent but fails to reinvest in the stadium. £300k per season plus what we pay would be more than enough to ensure the playing surface is good enough for both clubs.
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Post by browny on Sept 15, 2014 11:45:22 GMT
Personally I could not give a damn about LW, there are as entitled to hire the stadium as we are and the only time we have any call on what happens is if the club purchase the stadium. If this happens we would all be sitting here saying its a good thing having them because they are paying rent. Would the club owners give up the revenue ? Not sure I believe they would Personally, I think this is a key point. Whilst we are also tenants of the stadium, the benefits to OUFC are absolutely marginal. If, however, we owned the stadium, it would be a different matter. Not only would LW be paying rent, but we would also be in a position to ensure that the pitch is installed and maintained in such a way as to allow dual use, as happens at a number of other grounds. Which is why I really do not understand the hatred generally on here towards LW who are really doing nothing wrong. Talk of protests at their games is unfair on them I have no interest in Rugby at the Kassam but certainly see no reason to try to damage their business
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Post by oxfordboy on Sept 15, 2014 15:26:24 GMT
I'll be doing a one man protest by not going
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