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Post by oxfordyankee on Feb 1, 2017 18:34:42 GMT
What's stopping DE Buying the stadium from the OXVOX group should the proposed plans go through? Clauses I should imagine. Why would the club want the stadium in private ownership again after spending 15 years trying to get it back You mean the fans, not the club?
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Post by oufcyellows on Feb 1, 2017 18:39:01 GMT
Clauses I should imagine. Why would the club want the stadium in private ownership again after spending 15 years trying to get it back You mean the fans, not the club? No I mean the club, not Darryl or any other future chairman
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Post by oxfordyankee on Feb 1, 2017 18:44:26 GMT
I'm not sure 'the club' as you've put it has spent 15 yrs trying to get it out of private ownership. In fact, up until October last year, that's all it has wanted, but under different ownership.
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Post by Scottish Yellow on Feb 1, 2017 18:48:03 GMT
What's stopping DE Buying the stadium from the OXVOX group should the proposed plans go through? Clauses I should imagine. Why would the club want the stadium in private ownership again after spending 15 years trying to get it back I meant the the club buying it.
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Post by oufcyellows on Feb 1, 2017 18:57:57 GMT
It will never be "the club" though will it, chairmen come and go, in community ownership the stadium will always be ours, and we won't ever end up in the situation we are now. De might be ok, but he could easily sell the following week, and we end up with a new landlord with worse terms than Kassam.
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Post by Mark on Feb 2, 2017 10:09:02 GMT
So who would actually end up owning the stadium?
and what would happen if someone came along to buy the club and wanted to finish off the stadium properly?
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Post by londonroader on Feb 2, 2017 10:48:13 GMT
So who would actually end up owning the stadium? and what would happen if someone came along to buy the club and wanted to finish off the stadium properly? I can't see that can be answered until the make up of the community trust is finalised, let's get the important thing sorted first in getting the stadium into trust ownership.
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Post by Yellow River on Feb 2, 2017 18:47:56 GMT
Apologies in advance if this has been asked before.
Are there any other examples in the Football League where the stadium is owned by the community trust and the club owned by someone else ?
From memory Exeter City supporters trust own the club, does that include the stadium ?
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Post by The Fence End on Feb 2, 2017 18:58:27 GMT
Surely those who invest in this deal will want a return on their investment one day?
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Post by oufcyellows on Feb 2, 2017 19:13:47 GMT
Surely those who invest in this deal will want a return on their investment one day? Do u expect a return when u give to charity ? I'd be more than happy to buy some shares and have no expectation of anything back other than the security of my team. I dare say that's the same for others like Stewart, just on a larger scale
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Post by ox4eva on Feb 2, 2017 19:47:24 GMT
Been saying about some kind of share issue, I certainly would not expect any kind of return on buying shares.
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Post by manorlounger on Feb 2, 2017 22:11:27 GMT
Surely those who invest in this deal will want a return on their investment one day? Do u expect a return when u give to charity ? I'd be more than happy to buy some shares and have no expectation of anything back other than the security of my team. I dare say that's the same for others like Stewart, just on a larger scale In the short term the return is knowing that my club have somewhere to play and call home. Long term, well, that would depend on how the stadium was run and the fortunes of the club on the pitch. I would not be investing for a short term profit, there wouldn't be one. There could be an offset cost on season tickets or preferential prices for matches not included in season ticket prices. A cup of tea and a biscuit at half time wouldn't go amiss!
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Post by oxfordyankee on Feb 2, 2017 22:20:09 GMT
Do u expect a return when u give to charity ? I'd be more than happy to buy some shares and have no expectation of anything back other than the security of my team. I dare say that's the same for others like Stewart, just on a larger scale In the short term the return is knowing that my club have somewhere to play and call home. Long term, well, that would depend on how the stadium was run and the fortunes of the club on the pitch. I would not be investing for a short term profit, there wouldn't be one. There could be an offset cost on season tickets or preferential prices for matches not included in season ticket prices. A cup of tea and a biscuit at half time wouldn't go amiss! Why would the club provide any benefits? They'll be tenants, not owners.
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Post by The Fence End on Feb 2, 2017 22:45:22 GMT
What's stopping DE Buying the stadium from the OXVOX group should the proposed plans go through? Clauses I should imagine. Why would the club want the stadium in private ownership again after spending 15 years trying to get it back What if the ground was to be bought by the actual football club? That's the ideal scenario isn't it? The community thing just means the club has new landlords to pay rent to. In fact they'll be lots of landlords each with their own opinions, agendas and each wanting a return on their investment at different stages. Too many egos, I fear that the community deal will be a recipe for disaster.
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Post by backonthecoupon on Feb 2, 2017 23:15:14 GMT
Let's all give up and keep paying extortionate rent for substandard accomodation to Firoz then
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Post by oufcyellows on Feb 3, 2017 6:21:13 GMT
Clauses I should imagine. Why would the club want the stadium in private ownership again after spending 15 years trying to get it back What if the ground was to be bought by the actual football club? That's the ideal scenario isn't it? The community thing just means the club has new landlords to pay rent to. In fact they'll be lots of landlords each with their own opinions, agendas and each wanting a return on their investment at different stages. Too many egos, I fear that the community deal will be a recipe for disaster. What if you think of it more as an oufc trust than a community trust ? Where even profits may go back into the club. Again the club wouldn't ever own the stadium the chairman would, and your then open to the same thing happening . De could charge us rent the same as fk did, a new chairman could sell it off again. The best thing long term is to have the stadium permanently tied to the club. Who ever owns it
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Post by finlandia on Feb 3, 2017 6:35:42 GMT
Profits fine, but what if it makes a loss? Also, if it makes a loss, or breaks even, where does the money for player investment come from?
Surely you can't expect any chairmen to put in his own money without owning the bricks and mortar?
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Post by oufcyellows on Feb 3, 2017 6:40:36 GMT
Profits fine, but what if it makes a loss? Also, if it makes a loss, or breaks even, where does the money for player investment come from? Surely you can't expect any chairmen to put in his own money without owning the bricks and mortar? Well that's exactly what de thought he could do right up until recently. How many threads does it need explaining that the stadium will not bring in the millions of profit . Say de pumps another £10m into the club, because he owns bricks and mortar , what then ? It's not like a house, where you can cash out your investment at the end, stadium don't go up massively in value so He still doesn't get it back, unless he sells that bricks and mortar. So it really is no different .
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Post by myles on Feb 3, 2017 7:23:47 GMT
Profits fine, but what if it makes a loss? Also, if it makes a loss, or breaks even, where does the money for player investment come from? Surely you can't expect any chairmen to put in his own money without owning the bricks and mortar? If the community trust makes a loss it should have no impact on the club. The club will, almost certainly, be using the stadium under a long term licence deal which will set out the rent payable etc. The StadCo won't be able to change that unilaterally. So, actually the club is better off in this situation than if it actually owned the stadium. I would not have said this several years ago, but I think it's actually important now to keep a separation between club and stadium. It prevents the club from racking up huge debts secured against the stadium, avoiding situations like when we were back at the Manor.
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Post by The Fence End on Feb 3, 2017 7:32:54 GMT
Let's all give up and keep paying extortionate rent for substandard accomodation to Firoz then That won't change, only the landlord will. I hope this group will sell to the club eventually.
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Post by saddletramp on Feb 3, 2017 7:40:29 GMT
Apologies in advance if this has been asked before. Are there any other examples in the Football League where the stadium is owned by the community trust and the club owned by someone else ? From memory Exeter City supporters trust own the club, does that include the stadium ? The skip is owned by Swindon council. They pay £17k per month rent(2015),but are responsible for all maintenance costs.
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Post by bashamwonderland on Feb 3, 2017 7:47:03 GMT
A community trust is the best way, splitting the ground and the club makes it less likely that unscrupulous owners can come in and ride roughshot over all of us.
Plus, the club shouldn't be attempting to run a successful commercial property. It is better to have a body of professional oufc fans focussing on that side of the business so the club can get on with what's happening on the pitch.
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Post by foley on Feb 3, 2017 7:59:03 GMT
Let's all give up and keep paying extortionate rent for substandard accomodation to Firoz then That won't change, only the landlord will. I hope this group will sell to the club eventually. Whether that changes or not, the club have said many a time that the requirement is to grow revenues through the use of the stadium (which currently go to FK). So this most certainly would change if the ground is owned by the community trust.
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Post by oufcyellows on Feb 3, 2017 8:54:15 GMT
Apologies in advance if this has been asked before. Are there any other examples in the Football League where the stadium is owned by the community trust and the club owned by someone else ? From memory Exeter City supporters trust own the club, does that include the stadium ? The skip is owned by Swindon council. They pay £17k per month rent(2015),but are responsible for all maintenance costs. Council owns northamptons as well don't they ? On a 100 lease or something.
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Post by finlandia on Feb 3, 2017 8:56:47 GMT
Profits fine, but what if it makes a loss? Also, if it makes a loss, or breaks even, where does the money for player investment come from? Surely you can't expect any chairmen to put in his own money without owning the bricks and mortar? Well that's exactly what de thought he could do right up until recently. How many threads does it need explaining that the stadium will not bring in the millions of profit . Say de pumps another £10m into the club, because he owns bricks and mortar , what then ? It's not like a house, where you can cash out your investment at the end, stadium don't go up massively in value so He still doesn't get it back, unless he sells that bricks and mortar. So it really is no different . Ok - so if the Stadium makes a £1m loss and can't cover it, gets into financial trouble, who covers this? Where would this leave the club? In theory, you could have the Stadium company in Admin, with the Club a creditor? Not trying to be awkward, just playing devils advocate looking at worst case scenarios.
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Post by Gary Baldi on Feb 3, 2017 9:07:24 GMT
Well that's exactly what de thought he could do right up until recently. How many threads does it need explaining that the stadium will not bring in the millions of profit . Say de pumps another £10m into the club, because he owns bricks and mortar , what then ? It's not like a house, where you can cash out your investment at the end, stadium don't go up massively in value so He still doesn't get it back, unless he sells that bricks and mortar. So it really is no different . Ok - so if the Stadium makes a £1m loss and can't cover it, gets into financial trouble, who covers this? Where would this leave the club? In theory, you could have the Stadium company in Admin, with the Club a creditor? Not trying to be awkward, just playing devils advocate looking at worst case scenarios. That scenario has been the one that has concerned me most. Especially if another 1 million is needed to get the stadium back to an average standard (fixing leaks, making good bad jobs, etc)
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Post by Mark on Feb 3, 2017 9:13:08 GMT
I think Crawley recently did a deal where they are on a 99 year lease of the ground from the council. So they can't sell it or borrow against it, but can presumably make improvements, build new stands etc.
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Post by Yellow River on Feb 3, 2017 9:24:15 GMT
Apologies in advance if this has been asked before. Are there any other examples in the Football League where the stadium is owned by the community trust and the club owned by someone else ? From memory Exeter City supporters trust own the club, does that include the stadium ? The skip is owned by Swindon council. They pay £17k per month rent(2015),but are responsible for all maintenance costs. Thanks for the reply. So put very simply 17k a month = 202k per annum plus maintenance costs, as against OUFC currently paying 500k a year not including maintenance costs. Swinedon are potentially also able to generate more match day revenue as well under than agreement. Kassam will not sell to Eales. To my mind without knowing all the details a Community trust is the way to go, The Oxvox committee should applauded for all their hard work in getting thus far, and as Stewart Donald said let's hope he can help push this deal over the line. This is the best chance since the sockless wonder struck his deal we have of wrestling the stadium from Uncle Firoz.
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Post by Yellow River on Feb 3, 2017 9:26:08 GMT
The skip is owned by Swindon council. They pay £17k per month rent(2015),but are responsible for all maintenance costs. Council owns northamptons as well don't they ? On a 100 lease or something. Any idea what Northampton Town pay?
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Post by Pete Burrett on Feb 3, 2017 9:27:17 GMT
Well that's exactly what de thought he could do right up until recently. How many threads does it need explaining that the stadium will not bring in the millions of profit . Say de pumps another £10m into the club, because he owns bricks and mortar , what then ? It's not like a house, where you can cash out your investment at the end, stadium don't go up massively in value so He still doesn't get it back, unless he sells that bricks and mortar. So it really is no different . Ok - so if the Stadium makes a £1m loss and can't cover it, gets into financial trouble, who covers this? Where would this leave the club? In theory, you could have the Stadium company in Admin, with the Club a creditor? Not trying to be awkward, just playing devils advocate looking at worst case scenarios. Good questions. I feel confident that the OxVox committee are considering all these factors in their facilitation of negotiations between Kassam and OCC. Am I guilty of blind faith? I don't think so. Someone recently raised the excellent point about whether parking around the stadium would be adequate as we move up the pyramid. Jem confirmed this was part of talks currently underway. I'm sure whatever licence (or other) agreement is agreed, these responsibilities will be tied down.
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